DARK MILE, the band that features former DIO guitarist Tracy G and former QUIET RIOT singer Mark Huff have a new album out. Freight Train consists of 11 new songs, including the first track released to the public “Worlds Gone Mad” (see video below).
LINKS:
https://www.facebook.com/darkmileband
https://darkmileband.bandcamp.com/album/freight-train
Peter Kerr of Rock Daydream Nation recently organized and posted a zoom chat that included Mick Box, Bob Daisley, Peter Goalby, and producer, Ashley Howe. This was a lengthy interview and discussion on the Abominog / Head First era. Lots of never before stories from the recording sessions, as well as hilarious tales and involving the late Lee Kerslake, as well as Ozzy Osbourne.
Check out this great bit of Heep history.
British guitar player Sam Wood has had a busy career so far, and in the last few years his name has rose amongst us classic rock fans, having joined Thin Lizzy spin-off band BLACK STAR RIDERS a few years ago, guesting once with SAXON, and more recently substituting in for Mick Box of URIAH HEEP, for the band’s Scandinavian tour in January & February.
This was a very enjoyable interview as we discussed the bands Sam has played with, such as WAYWARD SONS, and including the details of his recent shows with Uriah Heep. As I go to post this Sam has a few dates left on a UK tour with one of his other bands THE DEAD COLLECTIVE, who have just announced their self-titled 4-song Ep is available for Pre-order (on limited red vinyl, no less!). We also chatted about Sam’s favorite bands and record collecting. Enjoy! *Check out the links below.
I want to go back and you can give me talk about some of your early stuff and how you got into recording and, playing in general as a professional musician. And what kind of got you to where you are?
Well, I suppose since I probably, like a lot of other people who are in this game when you start, you never really think about, when you’re a kid and first sat down with a guitar, you don’t really think about what I’m going to be doing when I’m older. You just find something that you love doing and you do it because you love doing it. You’re not doing it because you think there’s going to be a future there. But before long, you start to realize, ‘Oh actually, I really love this’. Yeah. And wouldn’t it be great if one day I might be in a band that might be playing in front of people or whatever. And so, quite quickly, I suppose it became apparent that it was going to be something that I wanted to dedicate my life to really or pursue at least.
So, when I was playing in a few bits and bobs here and there, but it wasn’t until I went to Uni when I when I moved up north. I went to the music college in Leeds, which is only about 15 miles away from where I am now. And that was when it really started.
And all of a sudden you go from being just a guitarist or a drummer or a singer or whatever you are – all of a sudden you’re put into this mixing pot of really talented people, and that just brings your game up.
That was that was a wonderful experience having all of that. And then I suppose I’ve just been playing in bands ever since, really. And it depends how in depth you want to get with it. But there’s a there’s a nice sort of lineage from being there all the way through to Blackstar Riders and everything. We just as with everything, it’s meeting the one right person. And they’ll say, ‘Oh, you might be good for such and such’. And before you know it, that link has been made and you go from there really.
If you sit down and think about it for too long, it gets quite scary – thinking, well, if one link in that chain hadn’t happened, you don’t know what you might be doing instead.
I find it interesting, because I gather you’re in your late 30s, so you kind of kind of came after that whole ‘classic rock’ tag had already started. So, a lot of the guys you play with are probably a lot older than you, so…
Yeah, as I like to remind them.(lol) But, I was very much brought up on my dad’s record collection. He was he was big into his 70s rock, glam-rock – T-Rex, Slade, Sweet, Thin Lizzy, all those guys. And so that was very much my musical education. That’s sort of informed, I suppose, how I play and the kind of where I’m I feel myself headed as a player. All the things that come more naturally to you because that’s what you’ve been listening to your whole life. And so and so it does mean, as you say, now you find yourself often in or around members of bands or playing with members of bands that you grew up loving, which is such a such a treat, but it’s an honour more than anything else. What an incredible situation to find yourself in.
It’s funny because I grew up in the ’80s mainly and I get the whole, ‘well, you’re listening to bands that are from the 60s and 70s’. But here you are playing with bands that your dad kind of grew up with.
Absolutely!
Can you give me your shortlist of some of your favourite players and albums and stuff?
Oh, great. I mean, probably the obvious ones….Mick Ronson, obviously. All the Thin Lizzy guys, particularly the Scott and Brian Robertson era. But all of them, all the way through from Eric Bell, all the way through to John Sykes; we’ve got Gary Moore, Snowy White in there as well. And Randy Rhoads and Michael Schenker.
I’m not really allowed to class all the Thin Lizzy as a guitarist as one, but I am for the purpose of this, so.. I’d say those four really are, the kind of foundation of probably what my style, or my interests really is as a guitarist. There’s a lot of other stuff in there. I was always a huge fan of Ritchie Blackmore. He’s playing Deep Purple and Rainbow. Hendrix as well, I always, always loved. But it was mostly those guys.
And a lot of the earlier I’d say the glam-rock guys, Andy Scott out of Sweet – What a fantastic player he was… and still is, of course. It’s one of those things whereas time goes on, you realize there’s a lot of a lot of other players who have made their way into your playing, the Saxon guys, for instance, Paul Quinn and Graham Oliver. I listened to a lot of Saxon when I was a when I was a kid. And I got the incredible opportunity a few years ago to step in with them, take the place of Paul’s side of the stage. So, learning the parts, I didn’t realize how much it kind of already seeped into my subconscious, and is there in my that I’ve picked up as part of my own playing style, which is lovely. It’s lovely when you when you find those parts that you didn’t realize were in there.
Yeah. Saxon was a band I got in later on in life. I’ve kind of seen them a few times because they’re not over here too often, but they came over with UFO a couple of times. So that was good. I love the Randy Rhoads stuff with Ozzy and that run of the Sweet albums in the 70s. People always put them down as a glam band, but if you are kind of a pop band, if you listen to four or five albums in a row, there’s pretty hard rock stuff.
Oh, absolutely. listen to all the B-sides. That’s the thing. They had the hits on the A-side that were written for them, but they were allowed to do their own B-sides. It always sounded to me like they just wanted to be Deep Purple. You know, they’ve got big riffs, big solos. What a band! And they had these huge harmony vocals as well. They could do it, as could most of the bands from that time, to be fair.
What was kind of your first professional recording type gig?
First, well ‘professional’ is a tricky word. Coming out of Uni, I was in a couple of bands that were getting out there as much as we could. You know, young kids, 20, 21, bought a van, just driving around the country, playing as many gigs as we could. Without a clue, really what we were doing, we just saw if we’re playing, playing more gigs, that’s what we need to do. We did some really cool stuff. Actually, we ended up supporting Wishbone Ash, a few other reasonably good sized gigs for where – for a band on our level we got quite fortunate with that. That was a band called ‘Treason Kings‘. And it was through Treason Kings that I ended up meeting Toby Jepsen from a band called Little Angels. And he ended up producing two EPs for us. And the whole time we were in the studio I was hounding him and saying, you know, ‘If you need a guitarist for anything, if I can be of any help. Please let me know. I’d always like to do it.’
Then one day out of the blue, I got a call from Toby saying he was he was putting something together. Now, originally, this was meant to be, he had a record contract for a solo album and he wanted to put a solo record together. So, he got he asked me if I’d play guitar on it. And we had Dave Kemp, who was one of the horn players in Little Angels, but he was on keys, and Nic Wastall from a band called Chrome Molly. I don’t know if you’re familiar with them (?), another new wave British heavy metal band from the UK. Fantastic band. And Phil Martini on drums, who I knew from The Choir Boys and Joe Elliot’s Down and Outs. None of us had played together before, but we all sort of came down and met in the middle, came from our various locations in the UK and just had a couple of days of rehearsal. Not even rehearsal, just room and time in a rehearsal space to have a play about with some ideas that Toby had.
And very, very quickly it became apparent that something really gelled. And that doesn’t always happen. You can put huge bunches of musicians together, really good musicians together, and sometimes it clicks and sometimes it doesn’t. And that’s not a slight on anyone; it’s just sometimes the chemistry with, not even as people, but with your playing doesn’t fit or whatever. But this really did. It really slotted together really nicely. And before long, we’d sort of turned it into a band instead. Instead of it being this solo album for Toby, it became a band. And that was where Wayward Sons came from. So that, in terms of being the ‘first’, that was the first band where it felt like I’d moved up. Because where it was with Toby’s past, we got a running start and we could start off with, his fans. He’s had a good solo career in the meantime, The Little Angels fans. So you can start off on quite a good footing. It felt like a real gift to be to be brought into that world, for somebody in my position where we’d just been in a transit van driving around the country trying to do what we could. That was the first real thing, and that was 10 years ago now, 10 years since we first got in a room together. And it just feels like it’s been just a very exciting journey from then, really.
What’s the current status of the band? It’s been a few years since you guys have had anything, right?
Yeah, well, it’s still very much ongoing. We were playing last year. There were plans for us to be doing something this year. But that has ended up, as often happens just through one reason or another, I think that’s looking like it might not happen now, but it’s still very much an ongoing concern. And we will be back at some point with some new music and some new dates. But no real concrete plans for that as yet. We all we all want to, and we will do it. That’s just been like so many, you know, COVID was terrible for lots and lots of bands and lots of artists and everything – we all know that. The biggest trouble that we had during COVID was not only that we were we in different parts of the UK, some of us were in different countries as well. We lost so much momentum through COVID that it that it has been a struggle. We’ve still been working since then, obviously, we’ve had had an album since then. But just felt like it’s taken a while to kind of get the wheels turning again on everything. But what it what it also has meant is that because we haven’t been on the kind of treadmill of it all, we now can afford to take the time and do things properly and just come back when we’re ready, and when the time is right. And I know we will. I’m looking forward to that.
What have kind of been the highlights as far as festivals and stuff you guys did over there?
The whole trip of that of that band so far was such a big part of my learning curve, as I suppose, a professional musician, on that level. So there’s been a lot of stuff that has that has been an amazing first time doing this or that. Download Festival really was a particular highlight. We were actually offered the main stage in 2020, but obviously, Covid came along and scuppered that, and so we were bumped onto 2021. Then that got cancelled again. Covid. But they stuck to their word and they gave us a slot in 2022 to open the main stages. I’ve been to Download, Download Festival was the Donington Festival, the Monsters of Rock in the UK. This is the legendary rock festival in the UK. And I’ve been there as a teenager and in my early 20s and camped for the week and seen all my favourite bands coming through. So, to get the opportunity to play on that stage was incredible. Absolutely incredible! And the fact that we opened the main stage on the Friday. the first day of the festival. And it was the first day back after Covid, after all that long period of nothing happening. It just felt like this this triumphant kind of return to everything. It was wonderful; It was absolutely wonderful. What an honour to be up there. I loved that. That is a real highlight, it’s got to be there for me.
That must have been crazy because you guys have those festivals over there. We don’t have a consistent festival, I don’t think, over here. Like, that one central one that everybody looks forward to every year.
I suppose we have the added benefit of being such a small island. And Donington is pretty much slap bang in the middle of it. So, everyone is able to congregate in one place where I suppose for you guys over there, it’s a much bigger place, it’s much harder for it to be a kind of central point, I suppose.
What led to the Black Star Riders gig? I’ve seen the band a few times over here with I think Judas Priest. I saw them as Thin Lizzy with a few other bands as well. But so they’ve been over here quite a bit. There’s obviously had a number of guitarists before you, so you’ve kind of followed Scott Gorham and Damon Johnson in that.
Yeah. BSR I know obviously, that it’s a modern band and a current band, but still very much a band that I grew up with. The first album came out in 2013, I was 24 at that point and a massive Thin Lizzy fan. So all of a sudden there’s new music coming out with the Thin Lizzy guys. Scott’s on guitar, Ricky singing. What’s not to love!? And it sounds like Black Rose era of Lizzy. Fantastic! Wayward Sons did a UK and a German tour with BSR in 2019, and I had been out on an acoustic tour with Ricky and Damon the year before that, which was both of those were a lot of fun. I just stayed in touch, I suppose. And I had heard through the rumor mill that Scott had been thinking of stepping down from BSR, keeping the idea of doing something with Thin Lizzy alive, but wanted to step down from BSR and nothing had been announced or anything like that. I just thought I’m just going to message Ricky and just, basically said to him ‘I’ve heard this might be the case.’ I couldn’t live with myself if I didn’t at least make contact just to say Hello, just as I had done with Toby in the studio with Treason Kings years before that – ‘If ever I can be of any service or any help, please do let me know.’ …No one ever feels completely qualified for a job, you know, it would be arrogant or it would sound arrogant to say so. But I mean, for me, being such a huge Thin Lizzy fan, I sort of felt like I know that I can approach this band from the right point of view, playing wise. Does that make sense?
Yeah.
I’d hope I would be able to give it a good shot. So I got a nice reply from Ricky, saying they weren’t looking for anyone or anything. Then probably about a year or so later I got a call from Ricky about stepping in with his solo band, the Fighting Hearts. If you haven’t seen or heard Ricky’s solo stuff, you’ve got to check it out because it’s absolutely fantastic. Some fantastic albums, great tunes. And so, I was I stepped in for a few gigs with them. And not long after that, I got the got asked about the BSR thing. Again, this was after covid. After Damon Johnson they got in Christian Martucci from Stone Sour, Corey Taylor’s band, who’s a fantastic player. But they it was working because (obviously) Corey Taylor was busy with Slipknot, and when he wasn’t busy with Slipknot, he’d be doing Stone Sour, so that would be the time that Christian was with him. And then in the time that Corey was with Slipknot, Christian would be on a cycle with BSR. And that was how I understand it, that was how that was planned to work. But then obviously Covid came along, levelled the playing field. Blackstar Riders was ready to go with a new album and a new campaign at exactly the same time that Stone Sour was. And so all of a sudden that threw all that out of balance and they needed a guitarist. So I, again, very fortunately, found myself in the position of getting that phone call. And obviously you say Yes to that when that comes along.
So, you were obviously familiar with all the albums, the catalogue?
Oh, absolutely! As I said, I’d been a fan since day one of the band. So learning the stuff, so much of it I already had and already knew, at least to listen to. That was such a such a ‘pinch me’ moment, on two levels. Firstly, sitting down to learn those songs to actually be a part of that. But then actually getting in a room, and you turn up and there’s all the flight cases, Black Star Riders flight cases, and Lizzy stuff’s all there. And you get in the room, and it’s the band – it was Ricky, Scott, Jimmy DeGrasso and Robbie on the bass. And it’s like, ‘What dreamland have I entered into here?’ And then counting in and away you go. And you’re there, stood stage right and Scott Gorham’s on stage left. Yeah. Mad. Absolutely mad!
Well, it’s excellent because there’s such a history already with the band and they’re still current. So, what is currently up with you guys, Is there any plans as far as recording or touring?
Well, we’ve got a got a European tour coming up, which would be nice because we had one show about 18 months ago in the UK, and that was the last that we had done. So, we’re off to off to Europe in September and October. The band, the band is still very much alive and still very much going. Ricky obviously is very, very busy with The Almighty and with the solo stuff. For this tour we’ve got Marco back on bass.
Will it be a 5-piece?
No, it’s a 4-piece. Scott isn’t there anymore. We did a tour in 2023. We did half the set as a 4-piece, and then Scott would come out and we’d do the last half of the set. And that was great, because I think that’s all he really wanted to do. I think he’s happily retired from Black Star Riders now.
That’s understood.
Yeah, you can’t say he hasn’t paid his dues. He’s still very much working away; he’s got his artwork he’s doing. He’s still very active, which is great.
So, we’ll be going out as a 4-piece. What I think a lot of people don’t understand about Black Star Riders, because it’s always been a 2-guitar band from day one, but Rickey has also played guitar as well. But because he’s the frontman, he’s never really had the chance to be the lead guitarist. He’s a fantastic guitar player. He’s a really good guitarist, and can absolutely hold his own with the twin leads, and the riffing, and everything. Not to mention that he’s responsible for a lot of the riffs and the guitar parts that are in the songs anyway. I think he surprised a lot of people on that tour, and on subsequent gigs to see Rickey playing those lead parts and having such an active role as a guitarist in what has always been a 2-guitar band. He can do it, and he does it. It’s really great to play with him; it really sounds fab!
Have you guys talked about doing any writing or anything new?
I really hope that will be on the cards. That always very much been the plan. No real concrete plan at the moment, but I’m sure there will be, at some point. We’ve all got to get back in the same country, at the same time, before any of that can happen. All in good time.
Do you collect much? (showing my BSR LPs)
Yeah. To be honest, modern albums, I don’t have so many, but I love record fairs, record shops, and just being able to flick through and finding odd things you just fall in love with because of the sleeve. You just go ‘Oh I wonder what that’s like?’, which is getting harder to do because, obviously they are getting more expensive, whereas it was nice just to be able to spend less than a dollar, just flicking through and you could see something that you liked and try it out. And if you liked it, great – If you didn’t, you spent less than a dollar on it. So, yeah, I love it… But great, you’ve got the BSR, all on vinyl.
I’ve got the five of them. It’s funny because back in the ‘90s when vinyl went out of style, you could buy tons of it for two bucks a piece, and now that stuff is all suddenly worth 10, 20 bucks, 30 bucks each, right!?
Absolutely, yeah… And up sometimes, all of a sudden things can be very, very valuable.
The thing about it as well, and I feel that like the younger generation, like sort of kids in their teenage years now who have only they’ve grown up in a digital world, they are now the ones that are buying vinyl, cassettes, CDs, because actually they want to hold something. They want to have something that is theirs. You know, when I was a kid, when you were a kid, I’m sure you’d save up your pocket money or your allowance or whatever, and you would save up when you go down, you buy an album that you really loved and you’d be on the bus on the way home kind of looking at the cover, reading all the sleeve notes and everything. And that was yours. And it was a was a sacred text to us because, ‘this is mine’.
‘I’ve saved up for this, and I bought it and it belongs to me’, this physical thing. And so, you took it home and you listened to it over and over and over again because, you’d spent all that money on it. And so, you really knew it.
Whereas these kids today have grown up with everything with Spotify, with Apple Music and everything, just being there. So, it doesn’t have any value to us anymore in the way that it used to. And it does feel like they are coming around to that as well, which is wonderful, wonderful to see that.
Yeah, when I get stuff to download for review or whatever the case is, I really don’t have anything but the opportunity to listen to it. But most of the things I’ll buy if it’s something I really like that I’m reviewing or whatever, I’ll go look for it eventually.
Yeah, absolutely. The thing is, we we’re all guilty of it. We’re all guilty of streaming and whatever. And you know what I’ll do – if there’s a band that I really like and I want to own something of theirs, if I can, I’ll buy it at a gig, because then that is the sort of purest way of getting it from, showing your appreciation for it. If you can just pay them for it at a gig. That feels like the to me, that feels like the right thing to do. It might be a bit more expensive than getting it off Amazon or getting it delivered or whatever. But, that’s sort of not the point at that stage.
Are you a completist when it comes to collecting bands?
No, not at all. (Ha!) There are there is there are so many bands. If you if you get a really good ‘greatest hits’, you can learn a lot about so many bands, that with the best of intentions, you always mean to go back and revisit properly. But no, I mean, with certain with Lizzy, The Sweet, they’re probably the only the only two bands that I know I definitely have everything they’ve ever done. And if more stuff were to become unearthed, I would go and seek it out. But no, they’re probably the only two that I know I’ve got everything of. I do love that, I love being so into a band that you really have every corner covered. And you really feel like you understand them. But it’s also nice finding a band and finding an album that you haven’t heard before or there is a different side of them that you haven’t expected. And then when you come across that, that’s still a nice little happy accident, isn’t it!?
I’m almost afraid to discover new ‘70s bands now, because if I go back, I’m thinking I got 20 more albums to go find.
But the flip side of that is that if you discover a new band, and it becomes your favorite band, you haven’t got to wait for them to bring out the new album to go and listen to it. You can just go back and get them all in bulk. And you’ve got their entire discography at your fingertips. So brilliant.
Do you have any favorites from Black Star Riders catalog?
I really love pretty much all of the first album, because when I was 24, 25, I, I bought that and had it on CD player in my car. The Another State of Grace album as well. I think that was the first one with Christian on it. That’s got some fantastic songs.
“Tonight the Moonlight”, I’ve always loved. It was the first single. But “Bound For Glory”, when that came out, it was just such a such a big…it felt to me – as a massive Thin Lizzy fan, but as a young fan… Phil Lynott died three years before I was born so, I’ve seen Thin Lizzy, Ricky with Lizzy and I’ve seen the John Sykes fronted version of Lizzy. But, I’ve never heard new music from it. I’ve never been able to get excited about new music from Lizzy before. And hearing that first BSR album, and “Bound For Glory” got quite a lot of radio play over here, it was just felt so special. It felt like I was able to take part in enjoying this, you know, the legacy of Thin Lizzy. I was able to actually enjoy being part of that as a fan.
Like a new chapter!?
Yeah. And it being a new chapter that was there for me. Do you know what I mean? As a listener, I wasn’t just listening to my dad’s records, records that came out 15 years before I was born. This is new music, it’s current and is for me. And that just felt so exciting. And yeah, “Bound For Glory” is always a favorite to play.
Well, I’m looking forward to more. The last one was good. The one song that stands out for me sounds strange is the version of “Crazy Horses”.
Oh, It’s great, isn’t it!?
I just heard that song a few years before and I thought what an odd song for that band (The Osmonds). That was a great cover. The Dictators did a cover the same year. There’s a few others.
It’s an absolutely fantastic song. I mean, even the Osmond’s version rocks! It really rocks. It sounds great. It’s an energetic record. Big overdriven guitars all over it. And the mad sound effects all over it. That’s great. t’s such a such a fun song. We do that live. That’s been in the set ever since I joined. I love it. The room when it when it first starts is normally split. Half the room is like ‘Oh, cool Crazy Horses. That’s great. I love that song.’ And the other half of the room is like ‘Crazy Horses? The Osmond’s? I thought I was here to see a rock and roll band!?’ And then hopefully, they have been converted by the time we get through this. Because yeah, absolutely love it, love playing that. I would love if, as and when time allows for new material, I would love to be able to ‘officially’ be a part of the BSR journey.
I don’t think there’s a Blackstar Riders live album yet.
No. I need to get my elbows in a few ribs about that maybe.
Now, when you talked about album covers, kind of picking up albums. That’s kind of the way I got into Uriah Heep, I was just looking at those album covers, and one day I thought ‘I’m just gonna take this! And that was what got me started.
Which one; Which album was the first one for you?
Demons and Wizards.
Oh, great.
I think I picked up like a two or $3 version of it at flea market and went back a couple weeks later about a better version of it.
Fantastic. And that was it. You were hooked.
Yeah. If you know the history of the band, it’s confusing, because you go to that album, then you buy something from the late 70s, and it’s a different singer, different sound.
Yeah, they have three completely separate periods. There’s 70s Heep, 80s Heep, and then modern day Heep. It all sounds, you know learning some of the newer stuff that I was playing with them on the tour, I just did, listening to the newer stuff, and this this sounds like a stupid thing to say, but it sounds exactly how you would want Uriah Heep to sound in the modern day. It does. It’s got it’s got Phil’s magnificent Hammond playing, obviously Mick, Mick’s guitar work is brilliant, Davey and Russ. Bernie’s a fantastic singer. Yeah, what a band. What a fantastic band.
And still a bit progressive, right!?
Absolutely. Still progressive. And what’s great, you know a lot of bands that are still going end up kind of going down, or it feels like they’re going down like a heavier, almost more ‘metal-y’ route, whereas Heep have just remained a very melodic hard rock band, which is great. They’re still doing that thing. It still sounds like it exists in the modern world. It doesn’t sound old. And I don’t mean that in a bad way. It sounds modern, but it just still sounds like them, it doesn’t sound like a betrayal of everything that’s come before.
And I think for them, the one thing about them now is that they’ve stayed current, putting out albums every few years, Deep Purple does the same. But there’s that old group of bands that just are content to put out the ‘greatest hits’ and be done with it.
Yeah. There’s a real feeling like they’re always pushing onwards, doesn’t it!?
So, I want to ask how that whole thing (tour) came about; I assume it’s through the management that you guys share(?)
Well, yeah. So, Uriah Heep’s manager, Adam Parsons, he’s also Black Star Riders manager. He’s a wonderful friend. Anyway, a few years ago, he was also managing Saxon, and he got me a gig filling in for Brian Tatler, who had replaced Paul Quinn. Brian Tatler had Diamond Head, and because Diamond Head had another gig that same day, but Saxon had a festival in Denmark. And so, I had to I had to fly in. I had plenty of time to learn the set. But he asked me if I could do that. So it was flying in, meet the band, no rehearsal and just go and do it, which was nail biting anyway. But it went really well. As long as you’re prepared enough and if you make sure that you know the songs inside out, you can do it. And that was a lot of fun. And Heep had the situation where they had the Scandinavian tour booked. This was in January, February this year. And a few days before the tour, Mick Box got very, very ill and was in hospital. He was in hospital and couldn’t stand up, let alone play guitar, let alone go to Scandinavia in January to play the guitar. So, I think this was maybe the Thursday night or the Friday night(?) I got a call from Adam, the manager, explaining this, saying ‘We’re in a real we’re in a real pickle here. Is there any chance you could do it? You fly out on Wednesday, first gigs on Thursday or fly out on Tuesday’. It was such a small amount of time. But I think, you know, the show must go on. And I’m so obviously… I was a mixture of completely honored and completely terrified to be asked. But I’ve got to say fair play to Adam and for the rest of the guys for still wanting to go ahead with that, because that’s a lot of trust that they’re putting on someone… I’ve played with Russ, the drummer before, but only a couple of songs at the Cozy Powell Memorial bash that we do every year. They didn’t they didn’t know me as a player. They didn’t know me as a person. I don’t know(!?) I feel that that is a lot of trust to put on someone. I’m very, very grateful that they did.
So, yes, a long story short – I had a few days to learn an hour and a half’s worth of the Heep back catalog and go out. I thing the first gig was the middle of the next week. I flew to Finland, met up with the guys. We didn’t have a rehearsal; we did have a sound check so we could run two or three songs. And I went through everything on the tour bus with Davey, the bass player. We just sat there with our guitars to kind of make sure I’d got the stops and starts and everything in the right places. But yeah, it was really flying by the seat of your pants.
Were you familiar with any of the catalog or much of the catalog at all or…?
To my to my shame, no. I knew as songs, but I’d never played them, but as songs I knew “Easy Livin” and “Gypsy”. But that really was the extent of it.
Heep had always been one of those bands that I’ve known that I liked them, and I’ve always enjoyed what I have heard of them, but for whatever reason, they were never a band that I had gone in and done a deep dive on. I really don’t know why, because it’s absolutely up my street – it’s heavy ‘70s, great guitar work, there’s the Hammond organ where I love anything with a Hammond organ on it. I’ve got no idea why their back catalogue hadn’t been on my radar like it should have been. So, “Gypsy” and “Easy Livin”, I knew. And that was it. And I don’t think I’ve played as much guitar as that – per day, probably since I was about 15. (LOL) I don’t think I’ve sat down with a guitar in my hand for that long.
So, they just gave you a set list and that that’s what you went with?
Yeah. Just ‘here’s the set list’. And I had a chat with Phil Lanzon, the keyboard player. I had a zoom call with him. It was the same set list that they’d done on the previous tour, when they toured Germany at the end of last year. He said, ‘I think there’s a full show that someone’s put on YouTube. Go and find that.’ Which was great for me, because not only does it kind of show what’s going on, but you’ve got all the guitar parts that Mick’s playing right there, and all the beginnings and all the endings, because they’re the things that can throw you off or can be different live to in the studio or whatever. So, it’s just like, ‘Right, here’s a definitive… This is how the set is. This is how it’s going to be.’ There you go, just learn it. I spent three days just glued to that screen. It sounds.
It was I suppose, more of like a ‘fight or flight’ thing when you get offered something like that. It’s just like, I know the end goal. There’s no margin for error, really. The end goal is on Wednesday, I’m going to be on stage with Uriah Heep for an hour and a half in front of a sold out gig in Finland. I have to know this set. I need to know every stop, every push, every solo. I just have to know it. And so, when you’ve got that as the end goal, it’s amazing what you can be capable of when you have to be.
I almost don’t want to ask but was it more terrifying knowing that Mick is the founding member and people look at him as, you know… ‘Well, he’s not there, so what are you guys doing.’ That type of thing…
Absolutely!
Because obviously there’s online commentary…
Yeah, yeah.
But if you want to see the band this is what you’re seeing, right!?
I know. But I mean, the fact that, I think I’m right in saying it’s the first time that Mick had not played a Heep gig, or they might have been.
I think there’s one in Germany in the early ‘70s where he got sick.
Yeah, but I think I think that was it. And obviously, Phil and Bernie have been in the band for 40 years. And Russ and Davey as well; everyone there has been in the band a long time. Mick, obviously founding member, and such an integral part. His guitar playing and his guitar sound is such an integral part of that band and how that band is. Weirdly, I think I think for me, because I was coming to it, when I when I started with BSR and because I was such a huge Lizzy fan, I was so aware of the weight of what these songs meant to me that that in itself was terrifying, because the notion of what you’re doing. Whereas with Heep, because they weren’t a band that had been on my radar in the same way, it was easier to kind of get on with it because I didn’t have that feeling of… I don’t know!? I suppose because I was coming to it fresh, I didn’t have time to get bogged down in worrying about that side of things. I was just like, ‘Right, I just have to learn the songs. I need to get up there and I need to do it. I need to do it as best as I can.’
When the announcement was made, I think I was as much scared about how it would be reacted to by the fans as I was about actually playing the songs as well. Because even though Heep, what Thin Lizzy represents to me, I know that the people that are going to see Heep on tour, that band means that to them. And you know that Mick is a figure in that band is as important as Scott is to me as in his role in Thin Lizzy. So that weighed on my mind quite a lot. And, you know, as usual, there’s a lot of people online before the gigs are even starting, going ‘This shouldn’t be going ahead. Mick’s a founding member. We should wait till he’s better.’ And the simple fact is that a band can’t afford to do that, really. As an absolute worst case scenario, if a tour like that has to be cancelled, then so be it. But it’s the sort of thing that could literally bankrupt a band. The amount of expense and logistics that are involved. I mean, when I got the call I think the truck with all the equipment was already on the way. It was already on it’s way, and already left the place in the UK where all the gear is held. It was already traveling to the gigs. And there’s three weeks worth of logistics and people who are relying on this tour happening, not just as fans, but like the bands, the crew, the support bands, the promoters. These people are relying on these gigs going ahead as their livelihood. You know, I totally get it. I totally get where people are coming from, where they say ‘Oh it should be postponed.’ And in an ideal world, maybe that would be something that would be nice if that could happen. But the reality, sadly, especially at the moment, the cost of touring being what it is, it simply can’t happen. Unless it’s completely unavoidable. But what amazed me was the reception, once we were there, was just fantastic, all across the board. I think people were so pleased that we’d shown up and the gig was still going ahead. And even though it wasn’t Mick, they’re still getting the songs, and they’re still getting the rest of the guys. And still, hopefully, getting a show that has the same energy, because Heep on stage have always been fantastic. When I’ve seen them over the years, even if I haven’t known the material as well, I’ve always enjoyed seeing them. So, if you can give a performance that is in keeping with what the fans are wanting or what the fans would expect. And I hope that we were still able to do that. Everyone seemed to come away having had a great time, which is such a relief.
I gathered from the clips I’ve seen that the fans were really receptive. Did you keep any souvenirs from the tour?
Souvenirs!? Not that I can tell you about. (Lol). I always keep a setlist that has come from the stage. I’ve the Saxon one, and I’ve got the Wayward Sons’ one from the Download Festival. I’ve got those framed, just as little artifacts. So, I always keep one of those. And there’s some lovely gifts that we got along the way, which is fantastic. Someone had sent me over the tour poster for the whole thing, Someone made some jewellery for the band and included me in that. Everyone was so lovely, and so receptive to it. I think it’s such a fine line when you’re dep’ing with something like that. I was trying to be very careful, because I didn’t want to copy Mick. I didn’t want to play his stuff note for note because that’s his. In the same way, Mick’s thing is all the stuff he does visually is fantastic to watch, but that is him, and it would’ve wrong for me to try and do any of that. So, you had to tread a line of ‘I need to be respectful to his guitar parts’, and there are some solos and bits that need to be exact, like the guitar solos in “July Morning”. Those solos are iconic. There’s room for you to put your own spin on it, but there are certain parts that do need to be exact. So, it’s finding that space where you’re being respectful of the original but not copying it. You’ve got to enter into it with the right spirit. I think as long as the spirit is right, people can enjoy that and hopefully see what you’re trying to do.
Was there anything that, as the tour went on, that you liked playing more or stuck with you more?
Yeah! There were loads of lovely guitar moments, “July Morning” being one, that awesome solo at the end that I was lucky enough to play every night. The other one, we had “The Magician’s Birthday” in the set. When I was first listening through the set, because I just went through it song by song when I was learning the songs…there’s no point in half learning everything, so I just need to learn each song one by one. And I got about two-thirds of the way through the set, and I’m ‘OK, we’re getting there.’ This was maybe Sunday evening, flights on Tuesday, OK “Magician’s Birthday” – what’s this? Ten Minutes long, ‘Oh, OK, let’s have a listen!’ And half of it is a guitar solo (Lol), this guitar solo that’s only accompanied by drums! That was the closest thing I came to picking up the phone and calling Adam, saying ‘I can’t do this!’ (Lol), or ‘Can we find another song?’ But, I stuck with it, obviously. And the first few gigs, I was enjoying myself on stage a lot, even from Day 1, I was enjoying it. But you see “The Magician’s Birthday” on the setlist coming closer and closer, and there’s this feeling of – not dread by any means, but worry, real worry seeing this coming up. But after a few gigs, once that sort of starts bedding in you go ‘OK, I can enjoy this now. Have fun with this.’ Because it’s basically just five or 6 minutes of just you in the middle of the stage, with a spotlight on you, with Russ playing the drums, just playing the guitar. And you’ve got 1500 people who’ve got no choice but to listen to you. (Lol) This captive audience, trapped. In many ways, it’s everything I’ve ever dreamed of. (Lol)
Have you had a chance to go back and check out more of the (Heep) catalogue?
I have. I’ve been starting at the beginning. I did have a copy of Very Eavy, Very Umble, so I’ve been going through. I have to be honest, when I got off the tour I did need some time away from Heep, because it felt like it had been quite an intense awakening to a band. But now, Ok, I really want to get in to this, because it’s so great.’ So, that’s where I’m at, I’m starting at the beginning and working my way through.
Well, it’s a long way to go!
I know.
What else do you have on the go?
Well, I’m on tour this coming month with The Dead Collective, which is Ollie Brown, who is a fantastic guitar player, and Wayne Proctor. So, the 3 of us have this band. We’re out over the UK, and we’ve got some new music coming out, which is lots of fun, very different, a lot darker, maybe a bit heavier. I really love that. And then more Black Star Riders stuff coming up at the end of the year. Keeping nice and busy; I just love being out and playing. It’s wonderful.
Do you get out to a lot of shows yourself?
I do. Where I am in Huddersfield, we don’t have a large venue, but we’ve got a very good venue, maybe 400 capacity, but a lot of bands come through; a lot of bands you see warming up or doing intimate gigs there. So, I’m lucky. And I do have Leeds and Manchester either side of me, which are big cities. So yes, I am still able to get out to a lot. The tricky part can be if I’m out gigging that does take up a lot of your time that I could be out seeing gigs.
LINKS:
https://www.blackstarriders.com/
https://www.facebook.com/TheDeadCollectiveOfficial
https://www.facebook.com/TreasonKings/
*Live photos of Sam with Uriah Heep courtesy of Lars Nonstad. from Trondheim, Norway, February 4, 2026
Back in the ’70s, bass player PETER WRIGHT played in a few bands from Wolverhampton. His early bands may not have taken off, but when Glenn Hughes left local favorites TRAPEZE to join DEEP PURPLE, a bass player was needed, and Peter auditioned for and joined TRAPEZE for nearly a decade, and played on the band’s next 3 studio albums. Now retired from music, Peter lives in Texas, but looks back fondly on his Trapeze days and recordings. Enjoy!
Did you have any recording bands before joining Trapeze?
OK, so here’s what happened. Like any good British kid, when the Beatles came out, we wanted to get a band together and one thing led to another and I turned professional. The first band I was in professional was called ASHLEY. And we we recorded, but we didn’t make albums;i t was all canned. And we had a road manager called John Kirby who worked with everybody on the face of the earth, and I told John about going out in the van. We had one van, and he had the van stolen from outside Wolverhampton Civic Hall. And the only thing not in the van was my 62 Fender Jazz Bass, which, I’ve still got to this day.
Anyway, so that was the end of Ashley. So then I was out of work and there was a guy called Johnny Neal, Johnny Neal and The Starliners, and they won Opportunity Knocks. You probably wouldn’t know what that is; It’s like a star search type thing. So John was the main guy and we were the Starliners, and that was great. I was really happy. We’d do like a week in Newcastle, a week in Scotland and Southport and that kind of thing. And I was always friends with the guys from Trapeze. I went up to pick up Terry, who was a sound engineer, and they were auditioning bass players. So Mel says “Are you still playing?” I go, “Yeah”. He says, “Well, bring your guitar up”. So I went up to JB’s in Dudley with my guitar and it was just Mel and Dave, and they were playing and I’d seen them auditioning other bass players. So I played and Tony Perry, who’s a dear friend of mine, he was the manager, Tony Perry, still is the main guy. And they went and had a meeting and I’m sitting there, waiting and Tony and them came out of the meeting and they said, “Pack your bags, you’re in!”
So that meant joining Trapeze, and coming to the States and making albums and everything. And it went great. But then unfortunately what happened was they got involved with Justin Hayward from the Moody Blues. They’d recorded, I think the first album John Lodge produced. Anyway, so everything’s going well. And then they were going to get involved with John Lodge and Justin doing Blue Jays. So originally Trapeze were going to play before them, then the Blue Jays would play. Well, they decided it was too much, so they had a meeting with Tony, me and Kendrick and that was the end of Trapeze for a while.
Then I came over to the States; I got married to an American girl and I’m living in San Antonio and I wasn’t working. She was based in San Antonio. She was a flight attendant and I got a call from Dave saying that Justin was going to be doing a tour and I needed a bass player. So I flew over and we started rehearsing at either Pinewood or Shepperton Studios and rehearsing, rehearsing, rehearsing. It was great fun. And then that tour never came together. Meanwhile, we put Trapeze back together, just me, Mel and Dave, and that lasted a while and then that’s when Pete Goalby came to see us and then Pete joined. Pete was with us to the bitter end, and we came over to the States, and the last gig we did was in New York City and trying to get a record deal and no record deal so I came back down to Dallas and everybody went their own separate ways and that was the end.
I want to go back. When you joined Trapeze, was Rob Kendrick already there?
No, Rob came in after me. But I’d been with Rob Kendrick in another band. So there was the three of us and I thought it’d be good to have Mel, to have Rob in the band to make the guitar playing a little easier for Mel. But Mel didn’t really like, well he didn’t like Kendrick at all. Mel was a great guy, great guitarist but a little bit finicky. It was all Mel’s band. We had some good times but we were really just a backing band really.
Rob was there and neither of you were doing all the vocals at that point?
Mel was doing all the vocals. Rob didn’t do any vocals. I didn’t do any vocals. It was all Mel.
It’s interesting because in the vocals he has that same sort of style as Glenn.
He does. He used to lose his voice a lot. Mel and Dave, they knew each other from years and years ago in a band called Finders Keepers. They went way back. Mel was a legend and terrible what happened to him; him dying and then Dave Holland dying.
Do you recall Peter’s band Fable? Were they around you guys?
Yeah, Fable. It was Wolverhampton and the agency was called Astra and Pete was with Fable. I saw Fable many times. We all used to congregate. It was called Club Lafayette and Astra, the agency, their office was right above Club Lafayette.
I see on Facebook there’s groups to the Wolverhampton scene from back then. You recorded the first album, the green one. (I hold up Hot Wire) This has got to be one of my favorite album covers. The Sundae. I think that’s great. Mel was writing all the songs pretty much?
Mel and Tom. Mel wrote all the songs. Tom helped out a little bit. You can see all the credits on the album. That is a great album cover – Hot Wire. It actually got in the charts.
I know everybody talks about Glenn being Trapeze in the early days but for me this one and Hold On are the best Trapeze albums. What did you think of this album? Do you have any favorite songs off Hot Wire?
I liked all ofHot Wire. “Midnight Flyer”, of course. That was always a good one. Then we got some live stuff we did. All in all it was great. So lucky to do all that. And come to the States – I still remember to this day the first time we came over to the States, flying over New York and looking down and going “holy fucking shit”. And the first place we played at was Oklahoma City. with Leon Russell and the Beach Boys in a baseball stadium in ’74. And then we flew down to Dallas and the old Texas stadium, which is no longer there, and Crosby Sills and Nash were playing and we were introduced to them. And it went on from there. Kendo lives in San Antonio. He was doing a Trapeze cover band for a while. I’m not sure how that went. But he doesn’t talk to anybody. We don’t talk to him. I’m still good friends with Tony, and Tony Perry’s daughter Susie. She does a great job. She was doing the F1, the motor racing. Now she does the MotoGP. So Susie’s a big star. She’s great. And then Susie bought a house in Wolverhampton right by Tony the dad. Tony’s got to be like 80, 81…something like that now.
I’m amazed. I know Trapeze, and there’s a number of Canadian bands like Moxy, Triumph and a few others, they had such a huge following in Texas, but then we’re much lesser known outside of that.
That’s exactly right.
There’s a Canadian band named Moxy that came out in the mid 70s and they were huge down there. And they still get invited to play down there once in a while.
Well, if you look on Spotify for Trapeze Hot Wire, the viewing figures are stunning. Lots of viewing.
Anyway, it’s great talking to Pete. What a nice guy, Pete Goalby. Me and him together, we’d be in the back of the car laughing and I was saying to Pete the other day that when we had the radio back in the day and if there was a good song that we liked, Mel had instantly changed channels, and me and Goalby used to have a good laugh. We used to play golf together, me and Pete.
I was telling him only the other day “do you remember Myra?” And he said, Yeah. Myra was my ex-wife; she’s the flight attendant. And I said, “Do you remember Myra coming over?” We went to their flat, me and Myra. I don’t know if we’d been smoking pot, but Myra decided to trim, prune this little kind of ornamental tree that they’d got. And by the time Myra had finished, there was nothing left of the tree. And I said, that’s what Pete and Mel did. He says, “Well, it grew back and we tried to smoke whatever it was, but it didn’t work out”. But Myra was smoking pot and then she decided she was going to trim the bush in Pete’s flat and there was nothing left of it. But then it did grow back.
Yeah, he had some stories about golfing with Glenn and that.
Yeah, Glenn didn’t play. I think we had one tournament when Glenn played. But we had a soccer team, the Shelby’s 11, and we played the Birmingham lot, Roy Wood and all them. You know, it was interesting times. But now I’m a big soccer fan and I’m a big F1, Formula 1 fan. And that comes from Austin in October. And it’s nothing to do with the group. So a guy comes in, I work at a restaurant, I’ve been at Cafe Pacific, it’s a seafood restaurant. I’ve been there like 42 years. This guy comes in just before the F1 race in Austin. And I’m talking to him and he says,” I can get you tickets for the Formula 1″. I said, “Sure you can”.
Anyway, so this guy comes up and he’s a home builder, must be, a millionaire. He’s got a mansion in Dallas and a mansion in Austin. So, you know, he’s going to get me tickets. So I get a text from him “Be at my house in Austin, 10 o’clock on Sunday morning”, the race on the Sunday afternoon. I took Annie, that’s a girl who works with us, she’s gorgeous. So me and Annie went down to this guy’s house – there’s 34 people there, two party black party limos with a police escort to the track. I need to tell you. I mean, that was great. We didn’t pay for anything. We didn’t have seats, we had a box, and we sat there, watched the race, went back to his house and then drove back to Dallas. And I’ll tell you something about it, just another day, saw him and I said, “We did this, we did that… ” And the guy says, “Oh, well, we normally use a helicopter”. And I said to him, “You’re not getting me in a helicopter.” At least if we’re in a plane, we may glide, you know. Helicopters don’t glide. So no helicopters for me.
Anyway. I’ve still got my Fender Jazz, and that’s the only thing I’ve got.
Do you still play at all?
No. I pick it up occasionally. But, people say “come and play”. I don’t want to go play in a garage band. I’m quite content, I’m 75.
How old are you? I’m 75. 56. No, you’re just a kid.
I was born in 50. 75. Jesus… I’m happy to still be going. I saw Lady Gaga about a week ago. I’m sure that’s not your cup of tea. But she was sensational. Sensational. Amazing show!
I want to talk about, touch on some of these other albums. The second one was a little bit a little bit more almost rockier, a little more mainstream; a little less funk, I think.
Yeah.
But then you had Glenn on a few songs as well.
Yeah, Glenn, w I think he did sing on a couple. He may have played bass as well.
What do you recall of this album? And then they did a little bit of a reunion with Glenn for a bit?
Yeah, they did. And Tony had a lot of trouble with Glenn. It was difficult, very difficult, and right through the tour, they thought about calling me back in. But it was already promoted that it was Glenn Hughes, otherwise I would have gone back in, but Glenn was very, very difficult.
But Glenn’s great now; I don’t know if you’ve seen what he looks like recently, he’s very thin, and always doing stuff. He got straight, he got off the coke earlier, and as we all do, I mean, I’m totally sober, I don’t even, don’t even drink, but I’m drinking at the moment a non-alcoholic Corona. Cheers.
Was there anything on this album that you particularly liked, or anything that…
Let me have a look…I’ll go get my, I’ve got my album on the wall.
You guys did that cover of “Sunny Side of the Street”, that was an odd choice.
That wasn’t us, that was Mel. I like “Starbreaker”, “It’s Alright”, was that the one that to Glenn sang on(?) “Gimme Good Love”, I think that was, that might have been done live, and then we did “Monkey”, “I Need You”, Soul Stealer”, “Nothin’ for Nothing”….
There’s a few ballads on there too. Did this one get much promotion?
It did, but I don’t think Warner Brothers were too impressed with it. In fact, I think we had to remix it… And that “Monkey” thing, that was a funny one.
So, you guys must have had a break after the whole thing with Glenn, and then this thing came out in Germany. (I hold up the German Running LP)
Yeah, I’m not sure that was all about, but yeah.
It’s the same album as Hold On, only different running order. That came out a good, probably a good almost a year, maybe six months before the other one (?)
I think so. Yeah.
That’s a great album. You guys worked with Jimmy Miller, do you remember much about him?
Yeah (lol). He was a bit of a character. Jimmy Miller, he was cool. He came on a few gigs with us. And then that live one, “Dead Armadillo“, the one that’s in Texas. That was interesting too. When Goalby was with the band, we played at the Armadillo, and there was like some strings on the first thing, it was recorded somehow, and then the drums came in, me and Mel would jump on the drum riser. We jumped on the drum riser, and Mel kicked the drum riser, and fell into the drums! And he (Mel) was always, something was always coming down Mel’s nose, he was like, from coke or doing whatever. And he comes over to me and he says, “Good job me nose was numb”. Oh Mel, what a character.
Was the six songs, was that pretty much all you guys played on that tour, that show?
Yeah, we hadn’t really got many songs, and of course “Medusa”, and one of the others was like 10, 15 minutes, so yeah.
And when we played at the Cotton Bowl with the Stones, I think we only played like, maybe for 45 minutes, and I think we only played four or five songs. But we always did “Medusa”, that was a good song,
You had got in Steve Bray by that point.
Steve, yeah. Dave was gone, and Steve knew all the Trapeze stuff because he’d come around to gigs. So, Steve was a good drummer and a real nice guy.
And then having Goalby in the band, and one of Goalby’s buddies was a sound engineer. So, it worked out pretty good overall, I mean.,Trapeze, the three-piece, Glenn often says, and I was talking to Susie about it, Glenn says he wished he’d stayed with Trapeze, and Susie says “Glenn says a lot”. lol
I find that hard to believe, because I don’t know if he would have had the international success he would have had with Deep Purple, correct!?
That’s right. And of course they played the California Jam, with Ritchie Blackmore. There’s no doubt about it, Glenn is brilliant — voice-wise, playing-wise, everything.
I saw him in 2018 over in Buffalo, and his energy was just unbelievable. He played for an hour and a half, and he could easily play for another hour and a half, I think.
Well, he cancelled his gigs this year for resting, he wants to rest. Well, when he used to come down to Dallas, when he wasn’t playing, he’d come down here for a, you know, a refresher on the drugs. I used to have to go find them for him. And we had a couple of hookers the one night, and me and him finished up talking and the hookers fucked off. Typical.
What’s your take on these two things? (I hold up Trapeze The Lost Tapes LPs)
Oh, interesting. I listen to them, and there’s some subtle changes. It’s good to hear them. Not a great difference, but still good.
I get the impression that some of these tracks weren’t exactly Trapeze tracks, or weren’t intended to be. Maybe they were Phenomenon tracks or something!?
Yeah, I think you’re right. I haven’t listened to them for a while, but I don’t know where I got my copies from. If Tom sent them to me, but I’ve got copies of them and everything.
What do you listen to? Do you just listen to a bit of everything?
Yeah, I do. The old stuff. I go to see the old bands. Well, it’s great to see Robert Plant, you know,he’s coming through. When I was at school, we knew Rob Plant. He was a local, ‘couldn’t get a gig, fucking guy for years’. So Rob Plant, and then I went to a soccer game with him. He was from Stourbridge, and I was a kid, and on a Sunday, the pub didn’t open until like 12 o’clock. And they were rehearsing upstairs in this pub. It wasn’t open, and I used to cycle up there, I was (I don’t know), maybe 16, 17,18, and listen to them, they were called ‘Black Snake Moan’. That was before he made it big, I listened to Planty. And Roy Wood was around; The Move, that was a real cool band. And The Who, I was a big Who fan, of course. They played in Dallas, and I got into the elevator, going to the promoter, up to his room, and who should be in the elevator, but John Entwistle, my hero! And I said to him “Oh, John I’m a big fan”, (or whatever I said). And he used Rotosound Bass Strings, the same as me. Well, I used them, same as him. And I said, “John I can remember when Rotosound Bass String were like $10”, or whatever they were. He looks at me and says “I don’t know mate, I’ve never paid for any!” Lol
*(If anyone can clarify photographers, please message me, thanks)
ALICE COOPER’s Alice’s Attic tour has added dates in September in North America. This will feature new British guitarist Anna Cara.
List of dates below (and on poster)
4.21 | Toledo, OH
4.23 | Columbus, OH
4.24 | Pikeville, KY
4.25 | Huber Heights, OH
4.27 | Virginia Beach, VA
4.28 | Durham, NC
4.29 | Spartanburg, SC
5.1 | Albertville, AL
5.2 | Albany, GA
5.3 | Pensacola, FL
5.5 | Fort Myers, FL
5.6 | Ft Lauderdale, FL
5.7 | Daytona Beach, FL
5.9 | Camden, NJ
9.17 | Louisville, KY
9.19 | West Springfield, MA
9.22 | Niagara Falls, ON
A little while back I had the privelage to talk with former GRAND FUNK RAILROAD singer, guitarist, songwriter, and American rock legend Mark Farner. I had got onto Mark’s latest album Closer To My Home when I’d featured a ‘story behind the album cover’ with album cover artist John O’Brien, in which John mentioned doing the cover for Closer To My Home. I got the album the next day, and it is exactly as I would’ve expected – a good mix of different great songs. And it is highlighted by a new version of the classic “I’m Your Captain (Closer To Home)”, re-done almost 55 years after it’s initial release in June of 1970, when it soon became a Top 30 hit in Canada and the US . If you were a Grand Funk fan, you’d want to check this album out. Mark still has a lot to say, and the man can still play and sing. But more on that another time….Enjoy the read, and check out the links at the end.
How important is it for you as a veteran rocker to produce new material as opposed to just living off of touring the hits?
Well, it’s important, but I think more importantly, to know that that part of me – the writing ability that I have, which is a God-given ability, God invested that talent in me, Kevin. I want to give him a return on his investment. I want to give more than he gave me. And it’s all about, because God is love. In my eyes, I don’t care about all this religious horse crap that’s out there. The modern day church makes me sick, to tell you the truth. So I want to give love the investment that he made in me. I want to give him that increase. And the only way I’m going to do that is by keeping in touch with the audience through the songs that I write from my heart. And people know who I am because I am who my songs say I am, brother.
I see a lot of bands from that era that are still going, but they have nothing new for 20 years. I saw your former bandmates about 15 years ago, and they just tour the hits. And there’s a lot of bands that do that, and they don’t offer anything new. If I’m going to see an old band, I want to see something new as well.
I knew there was something I liked about you right off.
Can you tell me a bit about the new album? It’s not like the ’70s where everybody’s doing two or three albums a year, you’ve got a little more time in between. How did all the new songs develop into an album, and what kind of got the ball rolling?
The new songs, the current new single, I’ve got a video for it on YouTube, “Same Game”, Mark Farner “Same Game”, and you can see the video there.
I’m curious, when you started the album to where it ended up getting released, what was the time-frame and what it started with and who you started with?
I got started on it, I had songs that I had already written. I’ve got a plethora of songs that are either just little fragments of a song, they’re ideas that I put down as I get that idea. Sometimes I don’t get the whole song, sometimes I’ll go back 15 years, 20 years and grab something that moved me back then. Now today, I’m seeing it in a new light. I’m hearing it with new ears; so I’ll finish that song. I’m compelled to do it that way. It’s inspirational for me that way. A lot of the songs that are on Closer To My Home, which is my latest, it is my baby because it’s got songs on there that are about my babies. “Tiny Fingers” is about my first son. A lot of people that have heard that song can relate because they’re parents and they have gone through some things as the evolution through television, and through movies, through the entertainment world that affects the way we live, the way we perceive life even.
It’s that evolvement and people are waking up to, wow, it wasn’t their fault. Maybe it was my fault. I let them go play that thing for hours. I let that thing be the babysitter. They’re kicking their self in the ass. But you can’t do that because that is not fruitful. You have to look at the lesson, keep it in front of you, and don’t do it again. That’s all. You don’t do that again. You let the love that you have for that child shine through. That’s what they need right now. I don’t care how old they are. They’re still our babies. I don’t care if they get as big as the side of the barn – they’re still our babies. That love connection is there in “Tiny Fingers”.
In my kids, I’ve got five sons, four are living. My youngest son died in 2018. He broke his neck in 2010, and he lived eight years and then he died. He was quadriplegic. He was on life support. We learned a lot because he had some revelations, spiritual revelations that he shared with us, and especially because his mother was in there so many hours a day, every day, that she told me things that he got in conversation with her. Just revelations, man, for a young kid, for a young guy like that. That’s helping us form new songs. That’s helping me. Whatever we’re going through, if we don’t get a hold of some forgiveness, initially forgiving ourselves for what we thought we screwed up, we can’t hold that against ourselves. We can’t hold anything against anybody because then we’re not going to get set free.
If we truly want to do what we’re here to do, what we were put in these bone suits to do, then we got to set ourselves free and set others free. That’s of this debt consciousness. But you see the whole thing, the money, and that’s what “Same Game” is talking about, the ownership of mainstream. Mainstream is sickening! The news is all lies. It’s complete lies. It’s manufactured. It’s Hollywood, man. It’s a big theater scene, and they keep writing the new lines every day. You got new lines coming in there. But it’s the same powers and principalities that rule the darkness of this world. They issue the various currencies to over 200 countries. There’s only five countries that don’t have central bank influence in this world. I think because of the sanctions that are put on those countries, they’re still under the control.
They’ve got but the songs that I assembled for this album, I was assisted by Mark Slaughter, and you know who Mark Slaughter is.
I’m curious how you got connected with him because obviously he’s remembered or known as more of a heavy metal guy from the ’80s.
Him and I were doing a Rock and Roll Fantasy Camp. David Fischoff has this rock and roll fantasy camp that people come to. They pay to stay with the artist for three days in a teaching session, in a mentoring session, where if I was a counselor, I would counsel these people. I would assemble, I would pick the songs that we’re going to do because there’s going to be a battle of the bands kind of thing at the end of it. It’s really a showcase at either a house of blues or something on that level, a theater where there is a stage and you can put a dozen guitar players up there because sometimes there’s 10 people in the band. But then we were in New York City and David Fischoff came to me and he said, Howard Stern wants you to come over and do your song. “I’m Your Captain” on his show today. And it was like a spur of the moment thing. I said, well, how does he want it? Does he want me to just sing it with an acoustic guitar? He says, no, man, take the fantasy band. There was Kip Winger on bass, Sandy Gennaro from Joan Jett’s band on drums, Teddy Zigzag from Guns N’ Roses on keyboard, Mark Slaughter on second guitar. There was Bruce Kulick, who did play with the Faux Funk for a number of years, but he no longer plays with them. Anyway, we were all there in that little studio where Howard is sitting and he says, ‘Okay, take it boys’. And so we played “I’m Your Captain”. And that’s the first time I had been playing music with Mark. I had known Mark for years, number of years. I loved his conversation. I loved his character, his nature. He’s part Native American as well. So, we hit it off really good. He’s tribal. So, we’re playing and when it comes to the harmony parts, he was hitting them on and he’s two feet away from me, Kevin; he’s singing it right in my face and I’m going, ‘Damn, this is pretty good’. This guy can sing. And Kip Winger over there, man, that boy can sing and plays the parts, and it was rocking. In the green room at that session where we did Howard Stern, I was playing a little something that we ended up putting on this album. Now I’m talking about, that was probably 10 years ago, that rock fantasy camp.
But, I was playing the chords to “Darlin”’ and Slaughter came up to me and he says, ‘What is that you’re playing?’ I said, Oh, it’s a song I’m writing. it’s called “Darlin’”. He says, ‘I want to work on that with you’. And so here, years later, we end up doing that song and it was just, it’s almost like, man, it was stretched out and it was supposed to be. And because of his encouraging words, and that’s just his nature – he wants to help people. He’s a giver and I’m a giver. So, we felt like even if no one ever actually physically purchased a copy of this, if they heard, then we’re giving them something that’s truth. We’re not giving them make-believe bubblegum bullshit. We are going to give them something that’s coming from our heart. And with his help, he helped me write a couple of songs. He’s got writing credit on a couple of songs in there. But his production skills and his, kind of coaching me to, ‘Hey, cuddle up to that; and can you breathe into, take a deep breath and make it yours, own this. And I followed his instructions and working with him was great. It was good for my future because everything I learn, of course, I carry forward with me. I’ve had a lot of good comments on my album. It’s not going to be embraced by mainstream, so it’s not going to be in anybody’s church. It’s going to be in people’s hearts, and that’s the better place.
I imagine you write from a different angle than you did 50 years ago. What do you normally draw from? Is it all personal experiences or any kind of news or outside influences?
I draw on what’s happening in our rock community. I always keep in mind that we have a community. Rockers have a community. And even outside of the ‘lamestream’, I call it, influence on it, they can’t break us. They’ve displaced us some, they’ve broken off parts of our body, but they cannot take our heart. And look at the people who attend rock concerts, man, avid fans, because we still believe. And love is driving us. It’s the need to be together. It’s peace and love. It’s without the beads, without the peace sign, without all of the hippie stuff, we’re still the hippie mindset. We still have that in our minds, and that’s what we want, leading our world, man. We want to be in a world where love shines forth. And this love for money, the money is created out thin air. There’s nothing to back the money. And I don’t care what country you’re in; the currencies are issued by the same banksters. And it’s the Federal Reserve, the European Central Banks, and the Bank of England for the majority, and then there’s the Superbank. But those people, they run the governments of the world, because money has control. It has taken control. And everything’s for this money, man.
I think that being free, the rockers that still hold the love for rock and roll and are still part of this community, it’s not about the money. It’s about the love, and it’s about our solid community that’s still held together by solid songs. So that’s what drives me to write the next song, is, man, I have a community that’s waiting to hear my next song, Brother Kevin. So I’m excited about still being alive.
When you go out and play, do you include a number of the new songs, or just a couple? I ask because there’s a lot of bands I go see, they have a new album out, and they play one song from it, or they don’t play anything. I like seeing bands, if they got a new album out, play a lot from it.
Yeah. Two or three. Because I’m a new band, but I got old fans. I’ve got fans that are from back in 69, I have to play that music along with my new music. And I found a comfortable spot with it, because we polled the audience, we asked people to send in the top 10 songs they want to see in a live set. So, out of 2700 people, we put together a good set list, picking the top 10 and then adding to that. And I think we got a good set.
People have, they’ve really embraced, we put “I Can Feel Him in the Morning” in the set, which is from the Phoenix album that we recorded in Nashville, when we broke away from Terry Knight. Our first album is the Phoenix album, and “I Can Feel Him in the Morning” was written by myself and the drummer, Don Brewer from Grand Funk. And I have it in my set. I wrote the music; he wrote the words. That’s what every composition where it was a Farner Brewer song, it was always that arrangement. I never once coached him on any words, or had him change any words or suggested even, I just let what he wanted to say be what it was. So, it’s receiving a lot of adoration. People never expected to hear that song in a live set. And I think where we’re at today in the world, people really, they want to be encouraged spiritually, and not the bullshit of the modern day church. That’s just lethargic; I mean, what’s going on, in my humble opinion. But they want the real stuff. And we give them the real stuff. It’s real love. We don’t expect anything in return. We just give, man. And it’s such a great feeling to have guys in my band that are all, we’re cussing Christians, Kevin. But we love God, we love Jesus Christ. And we play our music, even from the days when I was not in line with Christ I still wrote music because when I was nine years old, and my dad died, I prayed with Billy Graham on the television set that my dad bought five days before he died. And that television set, that black and white TV, when I walked out of the dining room where my mother and all the relatives were crying and moaning and mourning, and I walked into the living room, Billy Graham was on that television set because he was doing a revival in Flint, Michigan, at Atwood Stadium, downtown Flint. And that was being televised. So, when I walked in there, I hear Billy Graham say, ‘Are you hurting?’ Because I’m crying. I just came out of a room full of my relatives that are crying. I’m crying. I had to get the hell out of there. I mean, it was just tearing me up to watch my mother. And when I walked in and Billy Graham says, ‘Are you hurting?’ I look over. He says, ‘Do you need a touch from God?’ I’m going, can he see me? This is my first experience with a television set. We didn’t, I mean, we never had one. We always listened to a big radio, wooden radio.
And the TV was going on in our imaginations, all of, from Flash Gordon and Lone Ranger and, you know, all of this stuff that we listened to back in the radio shows. But now here’s a TV and this guy is saying, are you hurting? Do you need a touch from God? And I said, I just looked at him. I said, Yes. He said, ‘Come over here and put your hand on a TV’. And I walked over, I put my hand on that TV and I prayed with him and I received Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior. Verbally, I didn’t know what I was doing, mentally nine years old, but that was my commitment and my first taste outside of going to church with my great-grandmother who went to Free Methodist Church. And it was a church that functioned under a 501c3 tax exemption and they passed the plate and they took up a collection. I’m not into that. I am so against somebody passing a plate in front of me. It’s against what the Bible says about it. If somebody is compelling you to give, don’t give, period. If they’re compelling you, don’t give. You got to give from a cheerful heart because God loves a cheerful giver. And the only way that’s going to happen is when you do it for your own satisfaction to give somebody something, like I gave Don Brewer when he asked me if he could take 100% writing credit on “We’re an American Band”, the song. He asked after we were done recording at Criteria in Miami, Florida, we were recording. Rundgren wanted to record at sea level. He wanted to record our vocals at sea level. So, we took the tracks that we did in Michigan to Florida. He ran the tracks and we sang. And then when we did “American Band”, Brewer came to me and he says, ‘Farner, I’ve never had 100% right credit on any song. Do you mind if I take it on this song?’ I said, ‘No, go ahead’. It made me happy, to give him that song. And I won’t let any other scenario enter in. People have said to me over the years, ‘Man, you really screwed up’. But it doesn’t matter. The thing is, when I gave, it made me happy. And my happiness at that point came from God. And God is love. And that love that touches your heart when you do something for the right reason, when you give something out of the right heart, you don’t trace it. You don’t put a trail on it. You don’t follow them to see what they do with the gift you gave. You gave it. There is your satisfaction. Stay with that. So that’s what I have avoided all of the hateful stuff that people have said to me over the years. It gives me an opportunity to share, like I just did with you, how I gave it and how I am able to abstain from trying to retaliate against anything that has been done to me. I have to forgive with the same measure that I expect to be forgiven with.
It’s interesting because if I listen to the early Grand Funk stuff, there’s not, before you moved into specifically writing about that stuff when you went solo, there’s still a lot of spiritual messages and, things like that amongst the songs, like “I’m Your Captain”, for example, obviously, it’s not just about somebody sailing a ship. There’s more to it, right?
Right on, brother. Yes, sir.
So, how much connected were you with things aside from just the rock and roll lifestyle and…
Well, I was farming. I always wanted a farm, since I worked on my Uncle Jack’s farm in Marlette, Michigan. He was a dairy farmer, and every summer I’d go out and spend a few weeks on the farm with Uncle Jack and Marlene and Darlene, who were his twin daughters. Marlene was six, three, I think, and Darlene was six, one. They were strapping farm girls, and they could whip any man’s ass in the county. I’m telling you. But they made me feel very welcome to be there with them, and eating Aunt Verna’s homemade bread, and that homemade butter, home churned butter, and eating all this good food, and having the life… I’d drive the cattle down the road to the next pasture, to move them around. It was something that…It made me blossom, in my mind, as a young man. So the first thing I wanted to do when I started making money was to buy a farm. And I did! I bought 110 acres on one side of the road, and eventually 80 acres across the road from me, so I was hemmed in there pretty good. I had a place that I could call my own. And we farmed it. The guys that worked on the road with me, actually. The head roadie, John White, and we called him Ralph, I have no idea why we called him Ralph (lol). But Ralph, his dad was a dairy farmer, and Bobby Talbot, another worker from the road – another farmhand. And we loved being around each other, loved taking care of the animals. I had international grand champion horses; I had a few head of cattle. We were selling grain. And I would lease ground down there, where I was living, and sell grain. So, that was my lifestyle, and it really bled in to my songs, Kevin. Even on my solo stuff, when I did my Atlantic Records albums in 77, 78, there’s a song called “Easy Breezes” (sings) “Oh I recall a while back when I was younger …”, I’m talking about Uncle Jack’s farm. So, that helped influence all my music, being able to be relaxed enough. And I would be driving around the fields, like if I was running the mower, the engine is at either G-sharp or B-flat, or whatever, but it’s running at a tone, and I would start humming to that tone, start singing to that tone, harmonizing to that tone, and I would write songs going around in circles, on that tractor. So, I think that really helped me the most, being in a place where I could still think about everything I love, keep my mind on love, and even despite of my first divorce I went through I’ve kept my mind on love. And thankfully so, because I’ve seen so many people that have been married and divorced. And younger people that get married and they don’t even make a year – and they’re divorced. It’s like ‘are you kidding?’ What happened to love!? I’ve been married 48 years to my wife, so I know what love is, and it’s defined with one word – Forgiveness.
When we talk about the album covers and that, how much input did you guys have into that sort of stuff?
I didn’t have any input. All I did was okay them and say ‘Yeah that’ll look good’. Lynn Goldsmith did all of the 70s from beyond Terry Knight – from Phoenix on up to the last one, Born To Die. Yeah Glenn Goldsmith did all of them.
Now in that height of the early 70s What were some of the, other than obviously the Shea Stadium show, but some of the major shows you guys did and some of the bands you shared bills…
Yeah, as it worked out the band was headlining. I mean we headlined, so we had opening acts – like Jethro Tull was an opening act for us. Bloodrock was the opening act for us; Freddie King was an opening act for us. Only until we would play like a festival where there was a bunch of different acts would there be an opportunity to hang with somebody or to meet somebody. I think Janice and I, our relationship, we were friends we were not boyfriend-girlfriend friends, but we had a very tight relationship; we loved each other as friends. We hung out together as friends, and we shared the same mindset about the business. She was definitely what you’ see is what you get’. And what I loved about her – there was nothing ‘put on’ about he. We both felt the same about when they termed they came up with this thing called the ‘British Invasion’ ; we would laugh about it. She would say to me ‘Mark when you went and played Hyde Park when you when you guys played 65,000 people at Hyde Park. Did you sing in the King’s English?’ I said ‘No, I didn’t sing in the King’s English’. I said, ‘And none of those English bands sing in the King’s English’. They sing in the free people’s English, which is American English, you know all the rock and roll. I don’t care where – if they come from Australia, if they come from England or wherever they come from if they’re singing rock and roll they’re singing in American rock and roll English. It has to be American English in order to express because there’s no other people that are free, at least in our minds. Now we are realizing the captures took the place back over two days before Christmas in 1913 with the Federal Reserve Act. We gave ourself right back to the same powers. We declared ourself independent in 1776. But people want to be free; people need, we need to be free. We don’t want these people who are elevated high-minded people in their own They want to rule the world. In itself, just that thought is complete insanity, that would be defined as insanity. The Ruling class!? Well, how are they ruling? ‘Well, they’ve got more money than we do!’. So what! I didn’t vote for them. Are they smarter than you? Can they farm better than you? Can they raise better food? Do you know what’s good? Here we are living in the… I liken it to that movie where the ship goes down – The Titanic, and they’re playing cello and violins on the upper deck, but below the deck they’re playing music, they’re dancing. They’re having a good time; they’ve got the guitars, banjos, they’re dancing, they’re having a great time… That’s kinda how I view the world. Those people that are pulling this wool over everybody’s eyes, they are that phony upper-deck class! As phony as phony can possibly be. And then there’s the rest of us, the rockers in the lower deck music That’s our music that belongs to us So that’s our truth and the people that we love, that have been singing to us for years have been talking to us have been giving us good messages for years. I’, talking about the 60s and 70s Rock and Roll has stayed in there and It’s the desire of the will of the people to keep it alive because we don’t want love to die. If we gave ourselves to this notion of a one-world government then where’s the love in that? There will be no chance for love. So, we got a kick against it with all we’re worth um In that time.
In that early period when you guys were so big in America, Three Dog Night was big, Steppenwolf, a few other bands, and for a lot of you guys that success didn’t really transpire so much to the UK in that you had bands that were huge over here, but so much over there and then you had vice versa… know what I mean?
I think because of the ownership of the media in this country. It started it was wide open in ‘96 when Clinton deregulated the FCC, but they had their foot in the door long before 1996 They were taken over bit by bit by bit and that’s why there’s so much pedophilia in Hollywood. That’s the nature of those folks and why there’s so much, scuttlebutt on the release of the Epstein files and what all has been redacted in the files and all. It’s just the game. And the reason that the you know they are not released Is because there’s a lot of damning evidence on a lot of world leaders. So here we are today. I look back and we had 65,000 people, it was a free concert in the first place, but there was 65,000 people, enough people in 1971 Interested in Grand Funk Railroad to come and see us. And Humble Pie opened that show for us They opened a show for us at Shea Stadium. We brought them to the United States because when I told Terry Knight, who was my former manager, I said ‘Dude, these guys are rockers We need to have these guys. We need to bring them to the United States Open for us there. They’re really good’. He said ‘I’ll talk to their managers’. So, they ended up coming, to be our opening act. And look at what happened to Humble Pie – I mean, Frampton, that whole thing. If I went to Europe, I am absolutely sure people would come out of the woodwork to come see me. The thing is I’m with agencies that are mainstream and I think that influence that we’re talking about -that controls what we look at on the television; they control what we see in live music They control the music business. They don’t want me rising up in the music business because what I am saying, what I’m what I’m exposing in my songs. I believe that the rock community is alive and part of it is untouched by the Bullshit that these guys who are running the show, the Financial – the funny money show. Because you know, it seems like money makes people funny. They got enough money. That they go crazy with this want to rule everything, want to control us And we just want to be left alone so we can rock and we can encourage one another to live life joyfully and friendly. That’s how it was back in the 60s and 70s, that whole Hippie culture and the love. And that’s still alive in the music, in my music it is. Some of the newer people that have the younger bands, they don’t know what that is They know what they liked when they listen to the 70s music. I’ve talked to some younger bands, they go ‘Man you guys great. You were tearing it up!’ They don’t realize what’s happening, and I think when they do get a grip on it there’s some bands that are getting it. My son sent me some songs, and I don’t even know the name of the bands, but he sent me some songs and what they’re talking about with what’s going on in the world now. And I’m going ‘Alright man! Come on kids, pull up them straps, pull up them boots. Let’s wade through this shit and get on with life!’
I want to ask up when you guys added Craig Frost on keyboards What was kind of the catalytic for that as far as adding him and then kind of going further away from that kind of, more earthy sound of those first few albums with The three-piece?
I think the reason, and it was two against one. Don and Mel wanted to add a keyboard player, and I said ‘What is wrong with the 3-piece? We’re doing good out here; look at how many shows we’ve sold out!? It’s because, in my humble opinion Don Brewer wanted to write more songs and I only gave him just a few songs that I had written the music to And in every case where it was a co-write between Brewer and myself. I wrote the music, and he wrote the lyrics Well, he was wanting to get more songs, because the more songs on an album the more money you get as a writer That was his motivation. And I believe that’s why Inevitably, that’s why Craig was added. Even though I love Craig, even to this day we’re brothers man. I love the guy, he loves me. We’re seriously serious true friends. And when he came on, he was a great keyboard player. He started as a drummer He stood up and played the drums he I said, ‘Why do you stand up and play the drums? He said ‘Because I want people to see me; how they going to see me sitting back behind that kit!? I said, ‘That’s a good idea man, that’s a that’s a really good answer So that’s part of his, and every musician that’s a professional musician out there, it is their dream and their fulfillment of all their childhood dreams to stand up and be on a stage where people recognize them; be up in front of people where they are adored by people and they’re loved by people. There’s a lot of envy too, but I think you know when I was a football player I loved to hear my name called on the loudspeaker ‘That was Farner number 66 in on the tackle’. I’d be prancing across that field brother Kevin. And that’s part of what being on stage is about, it’s that attention and what that does for you as a person. I looked at the Beatles. I looked up to the Beatles, watch the Beatles as they climbed in popularity, and then I heard the music and I heard, you know, “Sgt. Pepper’s Lonely Heart Club”. It was a change in the lyrics and the topics that they were singing about I said to myself at that time, before I was a professional musician I said ‘Boy, with these songs that I’m writing now I have to be careful with it. I don’t want to lead people astray. Because I’m looking at the Beatles. I’m seeing the influence the Beatles had on the world and although I love the Beatles music, some of the stuff that they got into and I think it was Lennon who said that they were ‘bigger than God’ or ‘more popular than God’. And I said ‘Woah, what kind of ego bullshit is that?’ That comes from the pits, that don’t come from the heart. Anyways, the people that opened for Grand Funk went on to have their own stardom, have their own fame, have their own albums and what have you. It was great to get to know those people, but that was the only ones that we really got to know… outside of Jimi Hendrix. I had a relationship with Jimi, we were friends. We talked, we didn’t talk music when we got together, we talked about country stuff, you know fishing, and just life. We were we were good friends He wanted me to sing on his next album. He told so. And the same with Zappa. Frank Zappa said ‘Man, I want you to sing on my next album’. I said ‘I’d be happy to sing with you Frank. You’re a good person and I would love to sing on your stuff’. He sent me a demo of a song – “Bamboozled By Love”, that he wanted me to sing.(haha). But as far as some of the other bands that we toured with It was kind of people were kind of to themselves. I remember we played in upstate New York, Capitol Theater up there. We were on just before The Kinks. I really enjoyed the song “You Really Got Me”. And I think there wasn’t any rocker alive that didn’t like that song man, that was a great song. It’s like Algo Nova “Fantasy”.
Oh, he’s great!
That song rocks! So anyways, we get offstage, I’m sweating like a pig, and The Kinks are going on next. So, as we are passing on the stairway from the dressing rooms, the lead singer from The Kinks – Ray Davies, he reached out grabbed a hold of my sweaty body, and I’m going ‘What the Hell are you doing man!?’ He grabbed a hold of me, and I don’t know what that was about, but that didn’t feel very good at all! I’m seating my balls off and this guy leaps over and on to me, and he’s wanting…
The energy?
Whatever! He’s wanting that on him. When we played the Fillmore East we got off the stage to the dressing room, and our manager Terry Knight is leading the way and he never led the way any place, he always was bringing up the ass-end; bringing up the tail end of things But this time he was leading. He comes to my dressing room and he pushes the door open for me to go in and I look in – and there’s Hendrix standing there. I go Oh my God!’. I was so starstruck Kevin. And the only thing I could come up with to say was ‘You’re a great guitar player man!’ (lol) But we became friends and he knew that I was real. I knew that he was real. He was doing things, you know with the drugs, I could not do any of that. I played Randall’s Island with him one time where he we played, we had already did our set, I’m in the dressing room, I’m getting changed out, getting into some dry clothes, and Rabbit came over to our dressing room. Rabbit was Jimi’s right-hand man, and he says ‘Hey Jimi wants to see y’all over in his dressing room’. So, ‘Alright man, as soon as I get some dry clothes on I’ll come over’. I got dressed and walked over there, Jimi gives me a hug. ‘How you doing, brother?’ ‘It’s great, man you know a good audience man, you’re gonna tear him a new one’. I look over and Rabbit has got a hundred dollar bill rolled up and he’s handing me this hundred dollar bill, and I’m like ‘What’s that for?’ And I look down and they got these white lines and I said ‘No’. I handed him the thing back. I said ‘I can’t do that man’. I Don’t do that. I said ‘You guys knock yourself out, but I can’t do that’. But Jimi looks at me, he says ‘Brother Mark you know, I wouldn’t give you anything that would hurt you And I’m like oh my God, here’s my guitar here, and I’m 22 years old, maybe 21 (in there). I said ‘You know something, I’ve never done it before, I’m not going to do a lot, just give me a little taste, a pinhead or something. So Rabbit takes his knife out – hits the button and sticks the switchblade, the tip of it, in to one of those lines, and he says ‘Plug one nostril, I’ll hold the other, and you sniff it.’ And that’s what I did. And that was the first and last time! It felt like that stuff went through the top of my head, dude! And at that particular gig, I had already put packing blankets up on the cab of the equipment truck; it was a box truck with all of our equipment in the back. It was facing the stage and I put the packing blankets up there so I could go up there and sit and watch Jimi play. And it was stage level; I was right even with the stage at that height But those guys whipped that stuff up because the stage manager hollered ‘Hey Jimi you’re on!’ And he said ‘Okay’., …And Jimi walked out, but by the time he got to the stage and I was up on the cab of that truck Jimi was reaching for the neck of his guitar and he was missing it by a foot! Well, I’m telling you he was so messed up. He could not find that. He was looking at it. And then this kid – No shirt, No shoes and socks, just a pair of bell-bottom Jeans that he’d walked the excess length off of they were all freed out everything, long blonde hair… He gets up on the stage walks up behind Jimi, he grabs Jimi’s hand and the axe, and he makes the union and Jimi looks around at this long hair kid, a skinny kid, man I don’t know how the Hell he got up there, but he did and he put it together. Jimi looked at him like ‘Wow. Thanks, man!’ And Jimi tried to play, and I’m going to tell you – I was so embarrassed for him. He was playing something, but the guitar was out of tune, he was in the wrong key, the band was playing one tune and Jimi was playing another. He couldn’t find his ass with both hands. I’m telling you he was so messed up! And what happened was he went over and he stomped on his echo box button and tried to cover up for the fact that he was messed up, and he’s going to put everything into the echo box and it started going (Mark makes a dying engine sound). And while he’s doing that, this stuff that I snorted is getting to my mind. I got real sick to my stomach, and I fell of the truck, I passed out. And when I came to I saw all these faces looking at me going ‘Mark, are you all right?. Can you get up?’ And I was so sick, and I puked right there. Get me to the hotel! They threw me in the car, and away I went to the hotel. Like I said that was the first and last time. And I found out that what that stuff was, was cocaine and heroin – mixed. I have never done anything like that since. I guess I needed that lesson. It was the peer pressure of my guitar hero putting it on me , ‘Brother Mark, you know I wouldn’t give you anything that will hurt you…’ Well shit…. Lol
Tough lesson!
Yeah. I’m here talking to you about it today, thank you Lord!
I picked up a book, actually I contributed a bit to it – An American Band, by Billy James, many years ago Have you put down your own memoirs that you might release one day?
I’ve got people right now that are courting me on doing my own book. And I’m talking to them, because I need to put another book out before I pass. Some of the stories that I have within me would make a believer out of people. Not just in in the Lord Jesus Christ or not in the everlasting love of God, but in in miracles, in people, you know, who wondered about UFOs and such. I’ve had personal experience, so I want to – someday, do that do that book Richard Surratt, do you know who that is from Coast To Coast(?)
No, I don’t.
It’s the paranormal. Richard is a Canadian host for Coast To Coast. He’s just put out a great book I got to talk to him about some of the paranormal and he really brought it out of me and he’s had people on his program, on Coast To Coast, that people stay up all night to listen to this guy. He’s got a lot of listeners in the United States. Anyway, hopefully I’m going to get that book done.
LINKS:
https://www.facebook.com/MarkFarnerAmericanBand
https://www.instagram.com/markfarners_americanband
*Check out my friend Peter Kerr’s interviews and features on Mark Farner – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wS7uu5RAIgA
Well, not really new news, but YES have announced a new album and released the first single with animated video.Check out the press info below, the album art by Roger Dean, and the video.
YES, who is Steve Howe, Geoff Downes, Jon Davison, Billy Sherwood & Jay Schellen, are proud to announce their 24th studio album ‘Aurora’ will be released on the 12th June 2026 via InsideOutMusic/Sony Music. As Howe explains: “Making this record was joyful, a chance to play, explore and give everything to the music. It’s always been about collaboration, somebody can write a song, but until everybody puts their contribution in it isn’t really a Yes song. We’re not trying to echo the past; we’re carrying the spirit of Yes forward and turning it into something new”. The band are also launching the first single from the album, and you can watch the beautiful animated video for the title track, created by Matt Hutchings (Greg Lake, Oasis, Iron Maiden),
‘Aurora’ will be available as a Limited Deluxe 180g Light Green 2LP+2CD+Blu-ray Artbook & Poster, as well as a Ltd Deluxe 2CD+Blu-ray Artbook, both featuring the stunning artwork of Roger Dean and Freya Dean, as well as a bonus disc of instrumentals, and a blu-ray featuring Dolby Atmos, 5.1 Surround Sound & 24bit stereo mixes (by Curtis Schwartz). The album is also available as a Gatefold 180g 2LP + LP-booklet, Special Edition CD Digipak & as Digital Album.
Pre-order now here: https://yes-band.lnk.to/Aurora
Track listing:
1. Aurora 07:27
2. Turnaround Situation 05:50
3. Love Lies Dreaming 06:24
4. Countermovement 13:48
5. Ariadne 06:18
6. All Hands on Deck 03:04
7. Outside the Box 04:20
8. Emotional Intelligence 03:30
9. Jambustin’ (Bonus Track) 04:24
10. Watching the River Roll (Bonus Track) 04:42
When Yes first began sketching out ideas for what would become ‘Aurora’, the process was loose and exploratory. There was no preconceived concept at the start, just a collection of musical fragments that gradually began to find one another and take form. Among these early sketches was a piece titled “Aurora,” and it quickly became clear that the name carried certain gravity. It suggested light, emergence, and a sense of vastness, qualities that resonated deeply with the band. Jon Davison remembers how “the title immediately resonated with Steve Howe and sparked visual inspiration for artist Roger Dean, setting a conceptual tone that would guide the project.”
Work on ‘Aurora’ began almost as soon as the ‘Classic Tales of Yes’ tour ended in 2024. The idea of a new album surfaced quickly and with the label’s encouragement, the band had the time to develop material organically. Rather than gathering in a single studio for months, they embraced a modern workflow; ideas were born in home studios, shaped independently, and then woven together through constant collaboration. Downes and Howe often acted as the central creative axis, with Howe, as producer, serving as the point through which all ideas eventually flowed. Across ‘Aurora’, each track carries its own character. Some echo the classic Yes approach, others push into new territory, but together they form a cohesive whole that honours the band’s heritage while embracing forward motion. With their 24th studio album, Yes demonstrate not just longevity, but a sustained curiosity, a desire to keep exploring, keep refining and keep discovering their capacity to create.
Recently appeared on another episode of The Contrarians, with Martin Popoff, as well as Cam Crysler. In this episode we each picked our favorite and least favorite from Heep’s 5 studio albums released in the ’80s. Check it, leave your own picks.
What started out as me compiling a list of my TRIUMPH ‘top 10’ (or something like that) I quickley got off track, as I went back to revisit the band’s entire catalogue. The band really started taking off with 1979’s Just A Game album, which featured the US breakthrough hits “Hold On” and “Lay It On The Line”. Prior to that, Triumph, who formed in the mid 70s, and signed to Canadian label Attic Records released a single in ’75 with guitarist Fred Keeler, doubt this got much attention at the time, but the band soon changed guitarists, bringing in Rik Emmett. Their debut album was released in ’76, and this is what I’ve been listening to the last few days. Those first 2 Triumph albums may be very overlooked, by myself included, but here I am wondering why I never gave this one much more time, and why I never hear anything from it on radio (we still occasionally hear the band’s cover of “Rocky Mountain Way” from the 2nd album).
From the opening acoustics of “24 Hours A Day”, which kicks in to a rocker, til the closing near 9 minute epic “Blinding Light Show/ Moonchild”, this album is classic Canadian hard rock. Triumph mixes Emmett’s acoustic guitar, along with borderline metal like “Be My Lover” (w/ talk box solo), “Don’t Take My Life” (reminscent of Hendrix’ version of “All Along The Watchtower”), “Streetfighter”, and it’s mellower Reprise. The second half picks back up the ‘metal’ with “What’s Another Day Of Rock n Roll”, “Easy Life”, and “Let Me Get Next To You”.
Triumph, later reissued as In The Beginning, may be the band’s hardest rocking album. I loved this early direction, and the energy of this album. They’d fine tune it over the years to feature those epics that mixed softer acoustic parts with hard rock from album to album. If you’re not familiar with this debut, I highly recommend checking it out.
DOKKEN’s 1999 album Erase The Slate was originally released on CD (only). Deko Entertainment is releasing the album on vinyl for the first time in the US, limited numbers and 2 variants. I liked this album back then, so it’s great that it’s finally get a vinyl issue. In early 2000 I did an email interview with bass player Jeff Pilson for Erase The Slate. I also included a few questions on Jeff’s work with Dio, MSG, and other projects and plans. You find out more info and pre-order Erase The Slate in vinyl at the link here – https://www.dekoentertainment.com/post/dokken-s-erase-the-slate-is-now-available-for-the-first-time-on-180g-vinyl-in-the-united-states-thro
Jeff Pilson is the bass player from DOKKEN. He has also worked with DIO, and is presently working on a number of new projects such as a movie and a solo album! In swapping notes with Jeff, he agreed to do an interview and here it is. If you’re not familiar with what Dokken has been up to these days check out the band’s latest excellent studio disc “Erase The Slate” (on CMC) — which saw a return to the old Dokken rocking sound and featured the debut of new guitarist Reb Beach [who used to play for Alice Cooper!]. Or watch for the forthcoming Live album. For more info on Jeff Pilson check out www.jeffpilson.com
How did you get involved in music professionally?
JP: I started playing clubs at about 15 years old, and just continued on in bands through high school and college- then dropped out and had to make my living with it. A lot of starvation and good times!
Who were your earliest influences? fave bands and musicians growing up?
JP: Beatles, Zeppelin, Yes, and ELPQ: you play a lot of different instruments [reference to new album]
Is bass your first ‘love’ and or your best talent?
JP: Bass was my first, but now I really love to play everything. There aren’t a lot of preferences, but I really love to sing.
What bands [of note] were you involved with prior to Dokken? any recordings? anyone of notoriety that you played with then?
JP: No real notoriety, but I did play with an amazing guitarist named Randy Hansen, we had a band – no real recordings – but what a live show! Did a record called “Rock Justice” in 1980, was a rock opera on EMI. Good songs, but not a very good record – oh well we all learn!
You joined the band after the first album, replacing the guy who was in Ratt [i believe]. How did you land the gig?
JP: Through Mike Varney, of Shrapnel records. He’s a good friend and we played in bands together before that.
As I recall it was the success of “Alone Again” that opened a lot of doors for Dokken commercially in the ’80s, being one of the first great power ballads by a Hard Rock / Metal band. Would you agree?
JP: Yes, that’s quite accurate, it did open a lot of doors. We went from selling a couple hundred thousand records to a gold act almost overnite. People take you more seriously after that.
Throughout the ’80s Dokken turned out a steady set of strong Hard Rock albums, with decent guitar riff-rock, melodies, and harmonies. What would you put down to the band’s success in being consistent for a whole decade before the split?
JP: Good songs, a lot of internal talent, great business team behind us, and there was a strong core camaraderie between George, Mick and myself. I also had a strong working relationship with Don that I think helped bridge certain gaps.
How would you sum up the previous years [Dysfunctional , Shadowlife] prior to the change in guitar players and return to old Dokken rock direction?
JP: Rather scattered and not very focused. We weren’t all going in one direction, and not the one Don and I had intended for sure. But there were a few valuable experimental moments that I think produced some good music.
“Erase The Slate” is a real return to solid guitar rock in the best Dokken ways, yet [IMO] with a bit less of the big production feel some of the 80s stuff. Would you agree?
JP: That’s exactly what we set out to accomplish- very nicely put!
How was the transition from George to Reb? How has Reb Beach fitted in to Dokken musically and personally?
JP: Welcome transition and a new spark of life for the band. Reb is a great team player as well as being so talented – so for us all to go pretty much in one direction is amazing and wonderful.
The band shares writing and production credits on Erase The Slate. What can you tell me about how closely the band worked ‘hands on’ on this album, and what the basic songwriting process would be??
JP: We worked very much like a band. A lot of the music came from jamming, maybe Reb had a riff, then I’d throw in a verse riff, we’d all then take it to the next part, etc. But with us it’s so hard to formulate, anyone is capable of coming up with anything. And when someone does bring in a whole song, it generally gets pretty chopped up, but in a good way. We just threw a lot of ideas back and forth til it felt right – how’s that for a description!?
Why the cover of the Three Dog Night classic “One”? [Who’s idea?]
JP: Originally Reb’s idea for a jam during the live set, I thought it’d make a good cover for the record. It just seemed to fit Don perfectly and with all the harmonies and the rhythm we put underneath it, it just seemed right.
What are your faves from the album, and what is being pushed in the live set and to radio? [“Change The World” and “Who Believes” standout as having strong commercial appeal to me].
JP: I like “Maddest Hatter” and “Erase The Slate” best, also “In Your Honor”, but we released “Maddest…” and “Erase…” to radio. I wish there would have been more singles, and I think “Change…” would have been an outstanding choice.
“In Your Honor” stands out as a very different sounding song to the rest of the album [which is quite heavy], with the keys, acoustics, mellotron, harmonies…. What can you tell me about this song – lyrically, and how it came together musically? Inspiration?
JP: It came from a song I had a few years ago for my progressive band. Don accidently heard it when an old dat tape ran til the end and he said, ‘what’s that?’. He started writing the first verse lyrics right away and we finished the song in about 20 minutes. It really talks about missed opportunities and mistakes in love. Don had just been in a relationship that he was afraid he had ruined, and may never live down.
How has the reaction been from your perspective to Erase The Slate from fans and press?
JP: Excellent, best fan reaction in years. The traditional rock press has also been quite flattering.
How and when do you guys plan to follow it up? Any plans at present?
JP: Live cd at the end of April, tour in the summer with Poison, try to finish up my solo cd in any time I can find, finish work on my movie, then start writing and recording a Dokken cd in the fall. So yes, there are lots of plans!
How did you land the gig with RJ Dio?
JP: Ronnie and I have been friends since we toured together in ’84 – he’s also my neighbor! And Vinny Appice is one of my favorite people on the planet! They just came over one day and asked if I knew a bass player, I said “yea, ME!’.
How was Ronnie to work with?
JP: Absolutely the best, professionally and personally! Or as he would say in an imitation of me, “GREAT!”.
What did you think of the albums you were on?
JP: I thought we made some amazing music, and took several chances. It didn’t sound alot like traditional Dio, but that’s what we wanted to do and I thought we did a great job. It probably should have been called something other than Dio to get a more pure reaction, but that was what we needed on a business level to get through some doors. Kind of too bad cuz we were a great modern band, with trad elements.
How much did/could you contribute to the writing and ideas on those albums?
JP: We were extremely collaborative, and the sky was the limit with everyone. It felt very much like a band, but a well-oiled machine, something I wasn’t much used to!
Best memories of the Dio band and/or any stories?
JP: Just the intensity of the live gigs, and singing harmonies with Ronnie, what a powerful sound and what an honor!
What was your association with MSG? [Recordings, tours, etc..?]
JP: I played on the ’91 MSG album, then did an acoustic tour with them [playing acoustic guitar alongside Michael Schenker- what a trip!!]. Great fun – Robin is such a great singer and guy!
How was Schenker to work with? [Who else was in the band?]
JP: Great, he’s very precise and it was such an education to have him work with me on the acoustic guitar stuff, it was like being payed to have guitar lessons with Michael Schenker! But then in working out the electric stuff he was very open. It was just James Kottack [drummer – Scorpions], Michael and I working out the music, and Robin would belt it out. They were very band-like in their approach to making the record. And it was a good band at that!
What was your association with Craig Goldy? [see # 23]
JP: Craig and I had a project together for much of ’94 called the ’13th Floor’. It was very heavy and progressive music and something I’d love to release one day. We had to give that up when Dokken signed with Sony at the end of ’94. I still talk to Craig, and I know he’s really excited about the new Dio record.
What else have you been involved in recording-wise in more recent years?
JP: Oh God, a million tribute records, this ‘Metal God’ movie thing [I got to be musical director for much of it], and now I’m working on my solo cd. Someday I’ll release all the best parts of all the projects I did in the nineties, but I have a lot of new music to do til then.
What would you like to do in the future? any plans for a solo album or work with anyone in particular? [are you currently working on anything outside of Dokken?]
JP: I think I just answered that one by getting a little carried away on the last answer! But yes, I’d like to get my solo cd out around the time of the movie, and in the future put out my pet project “A Better Mousetrap” – which is very pop. I need more time in the day! But yes I’d like to put ‘Mousetrap’ out when I can, even if it’s through my website [here’s a plug- www.jeffpilson.com !!!]
What do you think of the return of many ’80s HR/Metal bands in recent years? Do you think the music biz has changed for better or worse since the ’80s when bands like Dokken, Ratt, Motley Crue … were huge on MTV, radio, etc… ?
JP: I think it’s worse in that record companies aren’t near as supportive of young bands as they once were. No hit and you’re done – that’s not good for music. There never would have been a Dokken if that were the attitude in the ’80’s. We took three albums to break! I think HR bands are at a bit of a nostalgia state at the moment, but I think young bands need a model for quality melodic rock, and I’m sure eventually there will be a call for that. That’s where us “old” guys fit in. The new school is very rap-oriented, which is to be expected, but there will be a need for melodic hard rock soon.
Can you give me a few of the following > favorite bass players, singers, songwriters, guitarists, etc.. [new and old] ??
JP: Chris Squire, John Paul Jones, Paul McCartney // Coverdale, Chris Cornell, RJ Dio // Lennon, McCartney, Sting, Paul Simon, Tommy Henriksen // Zakk Wylde, Reb Beach, Beck.
Q: Favorite ‘classic’ albums [70s / 80s….] and newer faves?
JP: Fragile, Close to the Edge, Bridge of Sighs, and anything by Radiohead.
I see you use Ampeg equipment, have you met Ken Hensley [Uriah Heep] through this? 🙂
JP: Ken is great. I was actually in the first batch of “new” Ampeg endorsees in 1986, and Ken and I have been friends ever since. What a great guy!
Hobbies, interests outside of recording and touring?
JP: Writing! And I love museums, art, yoga and all metaphysics.
Copyright KJ, 2000
Outsider Rock 