Hey folks, this is an interview I did with Peter Goalby on the occasion of his new archival album Don’t Think This Is Over. Kevin Julie has graciously accepted it for publication. It was a delightful, wide-ranging chat, but yes, if there’s any one thing I’d like you to gather from it, it’s that based on these songs, Peter should have been a big league songwriter to the stars, not to mention a famed vocalist past his well-graded run of three albums for Uriah Heep—enjoy! Martin Popoff
I guess to start with, why don’t you explain to me just a little bit, where these new tracks were recorded, like what sort of time period and what they were indicated for, I suppose. I mean, did you think you were going to end up in another major act kind of thing or were they going to be a solo album?
It’s exactly the same story as with Easy With The Heartaches and I Will Come Runnin’. After I left Heep, I tried various things to get back up there with the music scene. What happened was with the new album, which is obviously an old album, the songs are about 30 years old, just over 30 years old. And I signed a publishing contract and a recording deal with Rak Records in the UK; that’s Mickey Most. He was known for all the pop stuff, you know, Suzy Quatro, Mud, Hot Chocolate, all that kind of malarkey. Anyway, I signed with Mickey and we did we did two singles – both failed. But whilst I was under contract, I was on the publishing side of things, I was writing songs; that’s what I’ve always done, I’ve always written songs. And there was a falling out. He let me out of my contract. There was supposed to be an album. In fact, he did go over to America to sort me a record deal. And the story I got back from the people in the offices at the publishing company was he was offered a deal for me, an album deal, but they couldn’t or he wouldn’t agree with the terms. In other words, he wanted a lot more percentage than they were willing to give. And so, he walked away. Martin, that’s the story I got. So, the whole thing fell apart and that was the end of it. And I hand on heart, I totally, because I moved on, I was looking at other things as well. And those songs just got forgotten. And the reason that they reappeared is because the people that are looking after me now went to Rak Records and they said, would they consider releasing the songs? In other words, reverting the songs back to me, the copyrights, because they haven’t kept their side of the bargain. The publishing side of the contract was they would endeavor to try and get covers on my songs, from other artists, which they never did. So no, it was it’s called ‘non exploitation’. It’s in the contract that’s in my favor. In other words, if you don’t roll your sleeves up and do the job, the songs will revert back to the artists. So, it was absolute joy when Daniel Earnshaw told me these songs now belong back to Peter Goalby. I couldn’t even hum you a melody of one of them. I hadn’t got a clue. I mean, I’ve written a lot of songs anyway. I got an email and which said there’s a DAT been found in the offices at because RAK was sold and that whilst they were clearing everything out, there was a DAT and it hadn’t got a name on it. But somebody recognized some of the titles to be my songs. And in all honesty, I didn’t get very excited because I’ve heard all these stories and been there so many times before. But…I played the first song and I was absolutely delighted, I thought, my God, this is good. And then I played the second song and I thought. This is really good. After the third song, I thought, I don’t believe this. And I looked up to the sky and I said, thank you, God. I got my songs back, and not only did I get my songs back – they’re really good! I believe them to be very good songs. And for the time, if you look back and think of the late 80s when I wrote them and recorded them, and they still stand up today. We’ve done a lot of overdubbing. We put some good guitar work on there. And there it is – “Don’t Think This Is Over”. I’m absolutely thrilled with it, Martin.
Yeah, they are very solid songs. And you would think these could be absolute smash hits. How would you describe this kind of music if you were going to put on your rock critic hat? How would you describe these songs?
To be totally truthful, because it was what you got to remember, if you go wind the back, Easy With The Heartaches and I Will Come Running – All those songs would have been written anyway, whether I was in Uriah Heep or not in Uriah Heep. And most of those songs would have ended up, as I believe most of the songs or some of the songs, on the new album would have been treated differently because Mickey and the guys would have recorded them a lot heavier. A lot heavier. I mean, if you look back when we did, for instance, Bryan Adams “Lonely Nights”, it’s a pop song. But if you if you get the right players playing the song, it takes on a new meaning. I totally believe that I automatically write commercial songs. I can’t get away from the fact that I started off in a cover band singing everything from “My Way” to all the pop songs of the day when I was 17, 18 years old. And so I naturally write with introductions, with verses, with chorus, with middle eight, what I call a proper song. And part of the magic, and a lot of the magic that we had with Uriah Heep was. I would take a song, for instance “Too Scared To Run”, and I wrote “Too Scared To Run” two years before I joined Uriah Heep, but when I joined Uriah Heep and I did my audition, and I don’t know whether you know the story (?) – I’d already auditioned the year before, and it didn’t work out. Anyway, the second time around, when we were in rehearsals, I said, why don’t we try a song from scratch? In other words, I can sing “Gypsy”, I can sing “Easy Livin’”; I can sing pretty much all the stuff that they’ve done, we did it. So, we all started at the same place. And they automatically played “Too Scared To Run” in a lot heavier vein. And so I believe, the stuff on this album that’s coming out now, as we speak, it’s AOR. That’s what I think it is.
Were any of these (on the new album) worked up with the band? Were any of these put through the paces with the band, towards the tail end, say Equator, were any of these ever put through the paces by the band?
No. All of these songs were written after I left Uriah Heep. There’s nothing… I wrote “Blood Red Roses” for Mickey after I left. He phoned me up and he said, “We’re doing a new album. Have you got anything that would suit?” And to be totally truthful, I hadn’t at the time. But within about three or four days, I consciously sat down and I thought if I was still in the band, what would I like to put forward as a song? So, I wrote “Blood Red Roses”. But everything on this – my third solo album now, and every song that is on these three albums were written after I left Uriah Heep.
Did you have any interaction with Ozzy on losing or gaining Bob Daisley?
No, not at all. I didn’t know Bob previously, so there wasn’t really a relationship outside of the band, if you know what I mean. But Bob’s great. Absolutely fantastic. I love him dearly. And him and Lee were just fantastic. But going full circle, that’s what the point I was trying to make about 10 minutes ago. It’s because people like Bob and Lee and also John Sinclair and Mick, they think in a heavier vein than I write. And I think the magic that we had was because of what I do is a bit poppy in construction wise – and what they do is heavy. And the two meet, and then you end up with a song like “Too Scared To Run”. I could play you the original version of “Too Scared To Run”, and it’s nowhere near as punchy and as heavy. It’s exactly the same; It’s exactly the same words. It’s the same melody. It’s the same guitar riff. But it’s the way that these rock players, the professional, what I call ‘rock players’; it’s the way they interpret the song. I think that’s what the winning formula was. Definitely.
If Bob, Lee, Mickey and John had worked on the songs on this new album, they would have been a lot heavier. I mean, this album is a bit heavier than my last two in that there’s not so many keyboards on this album. Mickey loves the new album. In fact, I sent Mickey “Sound Of A Nation”, one of the tracks, because I could picture him doing it. not in the exactly the way that I’ve done it, but again, a far heavier version, like a rock anthem.
I knew Ozzy quite well. I’ll tell you a story about Ozzy because at the time we were doing Head First and Bob was splitting between us and Ozzy’s Blizzard of Ozz. And he was in the band, then he was out of the band. And the one day we were in the studio with Ashley Howe and I’d just done the vocal on “The Other Side Of Midnight”, from Head First. In walks Ozzy absolutely out of his tree, drunk with Bob. Bob was practically holding him up. And I’ve met Ozzy before and. They sat down and Ozzy had got a bottle of whiskey in his hand he’d walked in with. Well, I say a bottle of whiskey, about a half a bottle of whiskey, because half had gone. They sat down and I’d finished the vocal, and Ashley was playing it back and fiddling with something. I don’t can’t remember what he was doing, but he played” The Other Side Of Midnight”, and at the end Ashley pretended that it was a guide vocal. And Ozzy said, Fucking Hell! That’s a fucking guide vocal? I can picture him saying it right now. It wasn’t, it was the actual master vocal, and it was a fabulous vocal. And he took a swig of the whiskey. And, you know, like in the cowboy films and they take a swig and they screw the face up and say, “Oh God”(?) And he said, I hate this. I said, What!? He said, I hate drinking this stuff. I said, Well, why do you drink it? Then he said, I love what it does to me.
Was Ashley part of the heaviness because Abominog is recorded pretty harshly, right? It’s really exciting and visceral and distorted. What did he do to make that album sound as heavy as it did?
I think each member of the band would discuss the sound – like Bob, Ashley would say, I’m going to get you a good bass sound. So, Ashley would get the bass sound for Bob and said, Bob, what do you think? And Bob would say, yeah or nay. And in fact, another very quick story on Head First on “The Other Side Of Midnight”, you’ll notice the bass is quite actually too loud that was because Bob was in the studio when Ashley mixed the song. And when he was doing when he was doing the final mix, Bob leapt up from the seat and just pushed the fader up on the bass. He said, turn the bass up. It was a team effort, Martin. I mean, Abominog and Head First were both team efforts. There was just a great atmosphere. There I say there was no leader, Mickey Box is a born leader, but he doesn’t know it and he doesn’t show it – If that makes any sense to you. He doesn’t rule with a rod of iron, but he just suggests, well, what if we and let’s try it like this or whatever. But as I was saying, had the Heep lineup played this album, the songs would still be the same songs, but the solos would be heavier. The bass line would be. I mean, it’s a drum machine on a few of the tracks that wouldn’t be there, obviously. You’d have Lee thundering through. And if we were at a rehearsal, Bob and Lee would lay the scaffolding down and it would be a far heavier scaffolding than what’s on my album.
It could be a nice story that two or three of these show up on the next Heep album and it gives everybody something to talk about.
Yeah. I mean, the reaction to the album…I’m bound to say this anyway, but hand on heart again, I’m absolutely gobsmacked. People really do get it! John Sinclair iiplayed on “I Don’t Want to Fight”, In fact, John rearranged “I Don’t Want to Fight” for me. It captures the time. “Heart What Heart”, it sounds ridiculous, but I wanted to write a song… My favorite singer in the whole world is Dusty Springfield. Somebody told me that Ian Gillan (?), (another singer?), Dusty Springfield is their favorite singer as well. I can’t remember who it was…It was somebody out of a big band.
Ian might’ve said that…
And I was absolutely thrilled to think, well, it’s not just me.
How about did to what extent did Bob Daisley write any of the lyrics through those Heep albums?
Bob played a big part of the writing of the lyrics of the album. I wrote that it was Bob and I. OK. No one else. We wouldn’t let anybody else touch. The thing is, at the end of the day, Martin, I’ve got to sing those words. And Bob and I would sit down together in a quiet room and we’d work, work on the song together. As I say, it’s me that has to stand there and sell the words. So, it was me and Bob.
Any interesting stories of how you picked any of these cover versions on the album, the Russ Ballard song or…
Totally down to Ashley. Ashley had got a nest of songs, even before I joined the band. Ashley was such a massive part of Abominog. It was almost as though it was his baby. He obviously had plans even before I joined. Whoever had gone into the singing seat, I think it would have still ended up exactly the same. The band were under a lot of pressure. I don’t know whether I should tell you this, but obviously you want to hear it….when I’ve told it anyway. Mickey was given a whole bunch of money for Abominog. I mean, at that point, it was just the next album.
He had to put the band together. He had to sort the whole thing out. And a lot of the record advance had been already been spent when I joined. And so, we were in a bit of a dire straits situation, which nearly spent all the money. And we hadn’t even started the album. We were under a lot of pressure.
What were you paying for, like paying flat sums to the new members or..?
Yeah, and the rehearsals and the gear and all that. And to be fair, there are probably a lot of bad stories about Gerry Bron. But to be fair, as Mickey always pointed out, Gerry Bron always put his money where his mouth was. They never wanted for anything. So anyway, there was a lot of money being spent, and they hadn’t even got a full band together. He got Lee and Bob and then he got John. When they asked me to join, I was going to America with Trapeze at the time. And I said I was flattered, and I would jump at the job. But the problem was I’ve got to go to America for six weeks. I thought they’ll find a singer easily, but I went to America for six weeks, and before I went, I said, if you hadn’t found anybody, I would come down and rehearse and see if we could make it work. When I came back from America, I’d been back a couple of weeks and Ashley phoned me, and he said, “Do you want this fucking job or not?” That’s exactly what he said to me. Yeah. And I said, “sorry, but I thought you’d buy now you would have found a singer”. And he said No. Do you know they auditioned 84 singers!? It’s a fact. I’m not lying. Ask Mickey. They auditioned 84 singers! But, all of this time was going by, and Mickey was spending more and more money trying to hold the thing together. So, when we finally got a line up, when I actually joined the band, we were under so much pressure to do an album for Gerry Bron to recoup some of his money. Had had we been given the time to write more songs there would have been less covers. But to be truthful, Ashley and Gerry Bron had a vision, had a picture of making the band more commercial. So, we were on a bit of a loser because everything that we wrote. Gerry would say No. too heavy. And Ashley would be saying, “I’ve got this song …this would be perfect”. So I think between Gerry and Ashley, they steered us in the direction of a lot more commerciality. They wanted us to go to America and sell the band in America. Gerry and Ashley were a massive influence on not only picking the songs, but the whole direction of it all.
To what extent was anybody in the band aware or inspired of this great New Wave of British Heavy Metal movement around you and how you guys could fit inside of that?
Consciously, no, because we were automatically part of it. I remember when I first started rehearsing with the band, I used to stand there, Martin, and I’d think, wow, let’s just listen to this. It was just fantastic. And the band naturally played in the direction of what was becoming very fashionable. Again, I keep mentioning Ashley’s name; Ashley was such a big part of it all, but obviously the actual playing was down to the players. And I think we were all influenced consciously or subconsciously just by standing next to a jukebox in the pub, and you’re listening to Bon Jovi coming on and all the all these different bands. We used to do a lot of festivals and with Lemmy and Motorhead and all those guys. So, I think it just rubs off. I don’t think it was a conscious effort at all.
Looking back, I don’t think we purposely said we want to try and sound like this. Ashley might have thought that, and Ashley might have pushed it a little bit, to the way that he and Gerry wanted things to turn out. But we just played what we played. I was very proud of what they did to my songs, because there was “Too Scared To Run” and “Chasing Shadows” were my songs. It’s just the way that they played them.
Absolutely. What else would be a favorite of a Heep original on here and why?
“Think It Over”. I love that song. I didn’t know that already bloody recorded it. No one told me. I didn’t know, but they’d recorded it a year before with John Sloman. I thought it was just Ashley bringing in another cover. I love “Prisoner”. What I do get an absolute fantastic buzz from is when I, if I go on onto YouTube and put on one of those songs on and see the comments that people have put underneath. And they get it. And it really touches me that people get what we were doing.
It’s interesting. I like what you said about Ashley. I mean, the covers fit perfectly. And then if they’re steering you a little bit to, you’re less all-out heavy metal originals, that now melds with the covers and then there’s a couple pretty heavy songs on there still. So, you’ve got this nice range where it’s and we know the UK, and Kerrang, they love their AOR music, their American influence music. And then obviously there’s going to be a big hair-metal explosion soon. So, this is like a perfect proto-setup for that big hair metal explosion kind of…
As I say, direction-wise, we were just playing the way that we played. If we were pushed at all, it was Ashley that was pushing. He had a picture; he had a vision for this album. He wanted to take the band out of the 70s and put the band into the 80s.
Did you guys talk about the album cover?
Oh no, I Hate it. Absolutely.
What did everybody say about it, and how did the dialog go to come up with that?
I think we were all too polite to say, it’s yuck. I think what happened was because of Bob and Lee, and because of Bob and Lee’s background with Ozzy, the people that were doing the artwork for the album probably…I wonder, in all honesty, whether they actually listened to any of the songs, because I don’t think they did. Because if I was an artist, doing an album sleeve, I’d listen to the songs, and I wouldn’t come up with that picture. Would you?
Exactly. And how about the title? Where does the title come from?
Bob Daisley, I think it started off with ‘Abomination’, and it was taken from there. Maybe what went wrong was Bob did the title, and then the people looked at each other over the table and said, What picture can we put with this!? But to be fair, we were all too polite. Nobody would stand up and say, “Well, I don’t like it”. They’d say What do you think? Well, it’s okay. We were more interested in the music. I certainly had no say at all in the sleeve. And I think pretty much everybody in the band were in the same situation. I think it was just presented and we thought, well, yeah, we’ll go with that, not knowing that in a lot of areas, it probably did us a lot of damage, because a lot of people would look at that sleeve and think and run a mile. They’d run away and say, no, no, no; they would have this vision of some death metal band, which “Prisoner” and “The Way That It Is” certainly aren’t (haha). To be fair, it sort of worked against us, but it also worked for us, because here we are today, 40 years later, or whatever it is, and we’re still talking about the sleeve,
I think it gave you guys an extra little link to the New Wave of British Heavy Metal. You’re part of this trend that’s, going strong for three or four years?
Yeah.
What is that story of your interaction with Rainbow?
Well, I’ve never told the story, and really for two reasons. One, because I was embarrassed. I’ll tell you the story briefly, and at the end of it all, I felt that I’d failed, and it wasn’t something that I really wanted to talk about Martin because it hurt. I was with Trapeze, and I was sat in my apartment, (or my flat) at home, and the phone rang, and the voice on the other end said, Is that Pete? And I said, Yes. He said, Pete, this is Richie Blackmore. And I said, Fuck off. Who is it? And I tell you I thought it was; do you know John Thomas of Budgie?
Yeah…
I thought, because we all knew each other, and we’re all from the Midlands. I said, Fuck off, John. He said it’s Ritchie Blackmore. I was given your name, and he told me who, somebody given him my name and my phone number. And then I thought, Oh shit, it is Rittchie Blackmore.’ He said, the reason I’m calling you, I’ve heard a lot about you. A lot of people are talking about you with the stuff that you’ve been doing with Trapeze. He said, Would you be interested in joining my band, Rainbow? And I nearly fell off the chair! And I said, Yeah, I would. Things weren’t going very well with Trapeze, which is another story, (but we haven’t got time for that). We had a five minute chat, and he said, Have you got anything you can play to me? And I said, What now? And he said, Yeah. I said, Over the phone?, and he said, Yeah. I said, We’ve just finished the Trapeze album called Hold On. And I said, I’ll play one of the tracks off that album. On the Hold On album there’s a fantastic song. (I didn’t write it Mel Galley wrote it) it’s called “Don’t Break My Heart Again”. And the song comes in two sections, there’s like a slow, bluesy section, and then it goes into the proper rock version of the song. I said, I’ll play this song, I put the album on, and I put the phone to the speaker, and the song is six minutes long, and I thought, by the time it’s finished, he’s probably gone. At the end of the song, he was still there. And he said, Would you like to come to New York? And I said, Yeah. When?, he said Tomorrow? I went to New York. ..I’ll have to speed it up, because we’ll be here five hours, because I was actually in the band for two months, I never told anyone…Well, they never told anyone. Anyway, I went to Connecticut and rehearsed with the band… And the bottom line was, I got the job. I was told to go home, and Bruce Payne, who’s the manager, would call me, which he did. I was on the payroll. To me, that means I’m in the band. I went to Roger Glover’s house. We did a demo of “Since You’ve Been Gone”. I can’t remember the time frame, but I think it’s over a couple of months. And then we went to Geneva to start recording Down To Earth. Okay? We arrived there and spent a few days doing nothing. And to cut a long story short, one night, about 11 o’clock, somebody came to say, Ritchie wants to rehearse now. And so I thought, Well, what are we going to rehearse? I didn’t even know what we were going to rehearse anyway. Anyway, that was the way he worked. He spent three or four days in the bedroom coming up with ideas, and then he’d bring it to the rehearsal. I found it all very bizarre in that we went down into the rehearsal room, and they all just started playing and expecting me to start singing. And I thought What(?) I’d never worked like that before Martin. I would learn a song or sit down with an acoustic guitar and go through a song and say yeah, yeah, yeah, and learn it that way. Apparently, I didn’t know at the time, but I’ve learned that since they just expected me to make something up on the spot. And I can remember Don Airey looking at me and laughing and mouthing as though he was singing, and he was saying to me, just sing anything. He was trying to help me. Martin. And I thought, How bizarre!? So, I started coming out with something from The Exorcist (haha). I mean, no melody, and no idea how the song is supposed to go. Not even time to sit down and think, it was just start singing, just do something – which I did, and I felt absolutely stupid doing it. We did that for, I can’t remember how long(?) And it could have been an hour, it could have been two hours, I don’t know… Anyway, the next morning there was a terrible atmosphere. And Roger Glover came to me and said, Ritchie’s not happy. and I said, Well, I’m not happy either. I said, I don’t know what he wants…I can’t work like this. I haven’t got a clue what you want me to do. And at that point, Roger said, You’re fired!
That is ridiculous. Like, just a little bit of warning, a little bit ‘Okay, this is how we’re going to do this’. It would have solved everything, right? You’re just blindsided..stupid. (PG -Yeah) I can understand what they’re doing, they’re looking for a vocal melody or whatever, and you’re just supposed to scat over it or whatever…
What he didn’t realize was, I can write songs. The way that I put things together is I put a framework up and I get an idea. I totally get if Ritchie plays a riff, but you don’t need the whole band blowing the roof off for me to try and think of a melody. You sit in a bedroom. I can do all that all my life. I’ve written a few songs.
And what hour was this? What time was this?
Oh, 11-12, o’clock at night.
And you’re in Geneva. Is this like Mountain Studios or…?
No. It’s a chateau, with a drawbridge, moat, castle – the whole shooting match. We’ve got Jethro Tull’s mobile studio outside. We’re there to make an album. And not one of us knew what the fuck we were doing.
What a story! That’s ridiculous.
So, the day before I was fired, to pass the time away. I used to have a go on Don Airey’s Hammond organ. I can’t play, but I can put things together, and I’d work it out. I’d got an idea for a song, funnily enough… Anyway, when Roger said to me, You’re fired. I said, Why can’t Ritchie fire me? And do you know what he said? what he said was Before you go. can I give you a message(?) Ritchie said, “Do you know that riff you were playing on the Hammond organ? Could you show Don before you go?”
Unbelievable! So crazy. That’s just so rock and roll, right!? It’s like you’ve got these employees, just give them a little bit of guidance…Just give them a little bit of encouragement of how this is going to go, right!? You may hear from me at 11 o’clock tonight, or whatever, anything, right!?
Yeah. I mean, I haven’t gone into the other all the details. I’m just telling you a part of it. I’m not telling tales, I’m telling the truth. And part of the reason why I’ve told the story now is because somebody asked me. Nobody has ever asked me, what happened. So, I don’t mention it. “Oh Peter’s embarrassed. We don’t want to upset Peter”… And I had to come home and tell my wife, I’d been fired, and it broke my heart. I honestly don’t believe I was treated very fairly. I can sing for fuck’s sake, I’m a singer. I didn’t go for the job with Rainbow, Rainbow came to me.
And you’re a writer, and you’re a writer!
Yeah, but I’d never worked like that. I know that the likes of Aerosmith, Steve does that kind of thing, they write in that fashion. Somebody will come up with a riff,
But their nightmare story is they have to do that because Steven will do the lyrics at the very last minute, and they’re just trying to get the lyrics out of him. So that’s really problem there. That’s one of the reasons they keep fighting and breaking up all the time, and albums never happen, is because they can’t get the lyrics out of Steven.
So, to me, it was, it was like me landing on another planet…with the best intention.
I don’t want to keep you forever…
Do you want me to sing you a song!? (LOL)
What was the environment making Head First? And what is your feeling of that album versus Abominog?
I love both albums. The biggest mistake we made or in the four five years that I was with the band is changing producer. I don’t get that to this day. I just don’t get why we didn’t use Ashley. It was madness.
You mean on Equator!?
Abominog and Head First were like brother and sister. Just stop and think for one second, the way Ashley recorded, and the way those two albums sounded. Now, picture the songs on Equator, but recorded in the same way, they would have been fantastic. I wrote Equator. I wrote practically every song on there. I get if you don’t like the songs, I have to take the blame. But I’m not taking any blame, because if you go on YouTube, there’s some live stuff, there’s some live versions of some of those songs from the album, and Martin they’re good. They’re plenty good. But it was the whole way the record was recorded. The sound of the album is foul. I can’t even listen to it. And that was one of the main reasons why I left the band. I was so upset and disgusted with the whole… I mean to be fair to Tony Platt, Tony to this day, hand on heart, swears that’s not his mix. He believes that they lost the final mix to the album, and somebody did a very quick mix of the album. Now, I don’t know. I’m embarrassed by the album, not by the songs. I do believe that most of the songs would have been absolutely bang in line with what we’ve already done on the first two albums, had we had the same producer. And as I say, it’s just such a disappointment that Equator, it just sounds bad.
The sessions were fine. You got along with Tony through the recording?
I got on great, absolutely great. But at the end of the day, firstly, it sounds like it’s in mono. I don’t get that. Why would you do an album in mono? And Tony said he wanted to sound the band to sound authentic, like they would live. That’s complete bollocks. Why would you not want to make an album in stereo!? And, why would you absolutely drench everything in reverb? We’re not Def Leppard, Def Leppard is Def Leppard, Uriah Heep. Is Uriah Heep, I don’t want to beat Tony Platt up. I really don’t, but I just don’t get why that the album sounded so bad. But as I say, as far as the songs are concerned, I have to take pretty much most of the blame, because I wrote them (haha). Okay, I’ve got pretty much all the songs written. John Sinclair and I went and hired a cottage, and just John and I put the songs together and moved keys around, and did all this, that and the other. And then we took pretty much the whole album to rehearsals. Everybody in the band was, well happy with the material. Nobody said, Well, we don’t like this, or we don’t want to record that, or why don’t we record one of my songs!? Or we’re recording too many Goalby songs. Everything was fine. It’s all on paper, it all worked, but by the time we came out of the studio, it didn’t sound anything like what we thought it was going to sound like. But it was too late, as I say. Apart from the fact that we were working too much, too many gigs, that was one of the reasons why I thought I can’t do this. There’s got to be something better, and to be totally truthful, when I left, I honestly thought that I would walk into another gig, and the phone never rang. And it took me about 12 months to realize the phone never rang because the story was put out that my voice had gone my voice never fucking went anywhere. I lost my voice in Australia. I got laryngitis. When you nothing comes out, just air. I got that, and the doctors made me have four days off. And in the four days off, I wasn’t allowed to speak. And in those four days I thought, I’m not going to do this anymore. So, when I left the band, firstly, they didn’t believe me. I can remember Lee, Lee said, Oh, come on, we’re going to Russia soon. I said, I’m not fucking going to Russia. I’m not going and they thought I was just going through a bit of, you know, at the time, we didn’t know what it was, but I did have mental health problems. I have to put my hand in the air, because after I left the band, I did have a bit of a breakdown. But I think that was partly, because my whole world had fallen apart. But I couldn’t continue doing what I was doing in the way that we were doing it… So anyway, I’m going backwards.
So, did you tour Equator a fair bit?
We did some dates in America. We did a few dates in England, and live the material went down great. That wasn’t the problem.
Where did that title come from? Or where did Head First come from?
I think Head First came from Bob. Equator,i t may have come from John(?) I can’t remember, to tell you the truth.
I like it. It’s a cool title..
Some people don’t like it.
The album cover’s all right, too.
Again, we got a lot of snip, because the album sleeve was shit. I don’t think it was shit. It depends what you’re looking for.
Head First is a little more high-fidelity than Abominog, and you went to the Manor for that, right!? Any good stories about working at the manor versus the Roundhouse?
Well, the Manor was a far, far better environment. The problem with the Roundhouse was because Gerry Bron was the manager, and because Gerry Bron was the record company, and because Gerry Bron owned the studio, every time Ashley did a mix of a song. Gerry would say, No, mix it again, because every hour that we spent in the studio, guess who was getting the money? Gerry Bron! So, what started off that might have cost 60,000 pounds, because he got Ashley to remix the album about four or five times (lol), it cost’ about 150000 pounds! So, we were well pleased to get out of the Roundhouse. Again, to be fair that was down to Ashley. Ashley refused to work at the Roundhouse because he knew what the problem that we’ve got, Gerry Bron would have a so far in debt that would never make any royalties. But the Manor was a far, far better situation. I loved it. Absolutely loved it.
That’s right. If he’s getting paid for everything, no matter what advance he gives you, he’s going to recoup. It’s like he’s just paying himself, right?
Yeah! And then after Abominog was a big success and sold. I mean, you might know better than I. I haven’t even got a clue how many albums we sold. We were never told. I know it was a lot. And you know what Martin!? never got a penny.
Wow! If I was to guess, just estimate, off the top of my head, I bet this went over 250,000 in the States. I bet you could add another three to 400,000 in Europe, you know, mainland Europe and UK.
That’s the exact number – 700,000; that’s the exact number that I’ve got on my gold disc on my wall. But I guess that. I didn’t get the gold to pay for it. I paid for it myself.
I think that number sounds sensible.
Yeah. It could have been more. It could have been more.
Yeah…Japan, maybe 50…
And we never received a penny. He put Bronze into liquidation. Because…not just us, he had Motorhead, Manfred Mann, he had quite a few acts on there, and he used the record company money to start his Airline, and that went through the floor. And so, nobody got paid. So, from Abominog and Head First, none of us got any money.
Who did you tour with for these records?
In Europe it was always the same team. We’d go and do festivals nearly every weekend, nearly every weekend we’d be in one European country or another. There’d be Ian Gillan was solo at that point. Gillan would be on the bill Motorhead. Gary Moore, anybody that was successful at the time. And then in America, Judas Priest, I mean, the Mickey and the boys are still touring with Judas Priest to this day. Joe and the boys, Def Leppard, that was great. That was a fantastic time for us when we toured with Def Leppard. Just wonderful, wonderful people. When we were doing the stadiums in America with Def Leppard, and when we’d have our soundcheck in the afternoon, they would be playing football in the auditorium, and Joe used to walk up to the stage and say, Play The Wizard, Pete! They were big fans of Heep, the early Heep stuff like “Gypsy” and “Easy Livin’”, and all that. We got on great. We used to do the radio interviews in the afternoon, and Joe and I, or Phil and I would travel in a taxi together; we were just like family. It was just fantastic. We did the Texas Jam… Funny enough, we did, I did, I think it was 81 or 82, with Trapeze, and a year later I did it with Uriah Heep. And so there were all sorts of bands on there. One story that I like telling in Europe, we were always headlining. And the one festival that we did, it was from all day Saturday and Saturday evening, and all-day Sunday. And we’d played somewhere on the Saturday night, we drove through the night to the town where the festival was, and we got into the hotel about seven in the morning. At about 10 o’clock in the morning, I was woken up by this guitar-riff. And you remember “Radar, Love”, by Golden Earring(!?) You know the guitar at the beginning? I was fast asleep in the hotel, and it felt like the walls were shaking. The festival had started. They were first on it was about half past 10 in the morning, and I was lying in the hotel bed thinking, fucking hell! And you know what I thought, Martin, I’ve made it! I’m listening to Golden Earring live, and I’m not on until half past 10 tonight. And I just felt so proud.
It’s just always stuck in my mind. But as I say, I loved being in the band, but I hated all the rest of the stuff that went with it. To tell you the truth, I hated traveling.
Was that laryngitis, you say Australia, were you in the middle of a tour?
Yeah. We’d done Australia the year before, and we’d done really, really well. We did loads of television shows out there, and we did something like 30 live shows, yeah. And then a year later, our manager said, We’re sending you to Australia. And I said, I don’t want to go, because I saw the dates. I saw the dates. There were 42, shows in 36 days. 42 shows in 36 days. (Wow). I complained and complained and complained, and I actually said to the manager, Harry Maloney. If you send me to Australia, I’m going to quit. I’d already had enough, because this is Equator, remember all the shit going on with Equator. Anyway, they sent me to Australia. We were about to two-thirds of the way through the tour and Lee Kerslake took me fishing, sea fishing one afternoon, and whether it was the sea-air, I don’t know what it was, but I came from fishing into the gig, to the soundcheck, and I started singing, Martin, and nothing came out. I’d got no control over it whatsoever. And I thought, I’m in trouble.
How do they not know that you can’t put a lead singer through that?
Well, it’s the old story, you know, maximum three on – one off. Maximum! My world record is 16 back to back. I stood in the Hamburg Hilton with Gary Moore, and he came up behind me and kneed me in the back of my leg on it, you know, like when you’re kids, we call it dead-legging. And Gary Moore dead-legged me and I turned around, ready to kill somebody. And he said, Hello, Pete. And it was Gary Moore, and he said, How are you? And I started talking. He said, Fucking Hell, man. How’s your voice? I said, I’m struggling, Gary. I said, In fact, tonight… he said, Are you’re playing tonight!? They were all there for a TV show. There was loads of bands. And he said, Are you not doing this TV show!? I said, No, we’re actually playing live tonight. And he said, Are you going to be okay? And I said, I’m going to have to be. I said, This will be 16. He says, 16 shows back-to-back? And I said, Yeah. He said, I tell you something, Peter. He says, You ought to fucking sack your manager!? And I said, Well, funnily enough, Gary, meet Harry! (Harry was stood next to me) That’s a true story. It was a circus. Martin. It was partly our own doing, because we were really popular, and we could play anywhere in the world. You could go to any country in the world and say, you Uriah Heep. Oh, right! People know. They’re aware of the band. And that was the problem, you know!? And as I say, 16 shows back-to-back. We once did 23 countries in 30 days! That’s a lot. And people say, Why did you leave, Peter? And then I’ve got to live with the fact that because I’d left, the story was made-up that my voice was fucked. If my voice was so fucked, how come I’ve done three albums since!?
*Check out www.martinpopoff.com for my new books:
Dio: The Unholy Scriptures and Iron Maiden: Hallowed by Their Name
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My audio podcast is History in Five Songs with Martin Popoff (just Google it).
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